Last week, we got a call from a Regional Vice President of Primerica letting us know that a Revolution attendee was being trained in the education division of Citigroup. They wanted us to listen to her info and encourage her in the process of getting licensed to help other people.
Sniff, sniff. Something smells fishy.
So, wanting to encourage this person, we agreed to sit through the 30 minute presentation tonight. The moment the VP walked in with her I smelled – that sales guy smell that just wreaks like a bad cologne.
I worked really hard the entire HOUR not to withdraw or appear antagnostic. The bottom line is – the VP wanted Laura and I to refer Primerica (and this wonderful Revolution attendee) to everyone we know. He perceives that we know lots of people, and we are a potential goldmine for her (and him since she would be in his downline – of course, he didn’t mention that.)
He talked all about educating the public, helping people get out of debt, working with a Christian company, and all the other good-sounding stuff.
He starts to close the deal (after an HOUR), and he asks us if we’d be willing to recommend her to others. I said, “Well, I guess I’m kind of unclear as to what you’re really offering. There seems to be something behind the curtain.”
Oh, he didn’t like that. He got more direct and re-explained himself. I finally interupted and thanked him for the presentation. He conveniently needed to go out to his car to get us a couple of brochures. YEAH RIGHT! He went out to his car so that she could get a pulse on how things went and to nudge us along nicely.
So, you know me. I went straight over to Google and went to work. Look what I found…
PrimericaBuster.com
http://www.primericabuster.com
Primerica’s Deceptive Lending Practices and Other Con Jobs
http://www.ripoffreport.com/reports/ripoff127284.htm
Primerica MLM Scams
http://sastools.com/b2/post/79393875
Christianity.com Message Board: Primerica
http://fcnforums.christianity.com/Primerica?/m_90041/tm.htm
Primerica Employment Scam
http://www.ehmac.ca/showthread.php?t=25840
An Employment Scam in the Financial Services Industry
http://www.armydiller.com/financial-scam
As he was wrapping up, I called him out on the whole VP thing. I said, “It sounds like you have simply purchased a franchise. Is that correct? How many Vice Presidents work for Primerica around the nation?”
“4,500” – he responds.
What company has 4,500 VPs? C’mon – that’s just mumbo, jumbo language to make you feel like you’re talking to some bigshot. Didn’t fall for it, and I encouraged her not to fall for it either. I just sent her an email and cc’d the VP.
Now, I wasted 1 hour with him and another hour researching Primerica. Hopefully, this post will help someone else resist their ploys.
___________________________________
01.19.07 UPDATE: I got a call from a Primerica attorney who was concerned about this post. Read about it here.
Find out about Revolution Church – www.iNeedARevolution.com
davidtrotter.tv 
I AM A MEMBER OF EPC AND MY MOM WAS APPROACHED BY A PERSON THAT WAS GIVING HER SOME SONG AND DANCE. BE CAREFUL BECAUSE PEOPLE ARE OUT TO HURT OTHER PEOPLE PHYSICALLY, EMOTIONALLY, AND FINANCIALLY. ALSO, BE CAREFUL LEAVING MONEY AROUND BECAUSE HE IS STILL LURKING AROUND.
I’m sure you probably came across something positive while doing your research, but you were too busy trying to prove yourself right and you overlooked anything positive. Did you know that Primerica is a subsidiary of Citigroup, which is one of the largest and most profitable companies? Did you research that? How about looking at this website: http://ww4.primerica.com/public/primerica_press_room.html
You can click on the links on the website and you will read the actual articles.
Primerica also have some bad representatives, but it’s definitely not the company. Do you have a job? Do the company have bad employees at your job who does not represent the company well?
As far as the “VP” status. In Primerica, you are not a Regional Vice President for the company itself. These people are independent agents at which they are at the Regional Vice President level. Companies do that you know?
I’m not going to waste any more time explaining this for you because it seems as if you’re close-minded and will not see the opportunity, and I am very sorry for those close-minded people who will always be an employee instead of a business owner, and who most of them will always live paycheck to paycheck.
I have worked for Primerica for almost 6 years now and I know I only educate and market sound financial products which help people properly insure themselves, get out of debt. (most of the time without the need for a loan, only debt stacking) and how to save money for retirement through the investing in mutual funds. If educating people of the need to be debt free and Financially independent is not good for America then I don’t know what is.
Most American families are swimming in debt, not properly insured and are not saving enough or properly for retirement. Our services are of great importance to most families. I only wish you had invested more time into research and not based all of your opinion on a few websites.
You may not like our business model but it works. That is why I am here today and I love what I do. It fulfills me to know that I make a difference in families finances. Making sure that college account is funded. Delivering that death claim to the mother of two who’s husband just died in a motorcycle accident and knowing that they don’t have to move in with her parents. Freeing up $300-400 a month in a family budget to relieve strain in a marriage. Making sure people are properly saving for retirement so they are not hoping and waiting for that Social Security check alone. I think you should know that most marriages that end in divorce are directly related to $ problems. If you have been in the ministry very long and have had to bury a widow’s husband who now has no source of income, a mortgage, credit card bills and two hungry children looking at her then I think you would agree that what I do is important. I think a few hundred thousand dollars makes a big difference in that families life.
I am sure there are millions of people who would say Christianity is a cult and would have many bad things to say about Christians. If you just look at history you would know many atrocities have been committed in the name of JESUS and you and I know that is not the way of our Master. I have helped a lot of families with this company and I continue to do that day in and day out. The reason I ask for referrals is because I will be able to help another family down the road of debt freedom and financial independence. Word of mouth is the best advertising and that is why I do what is right for the client 100% of the time. I want people to refer me. If I “Do them Wrong” then nobody would refer me.
I do what I do because I care. The same reason you do what you do. I respect you for the ministry you are in and I hope you can respect me for the ministry I am in. Maybe next time you will not come down so hard on something or someone without doing your homework. I hardly think an hour of Googling is homework enough. Look at the positives in what we as Primerica agents do. Thank you and may God bless you in your ministry.
I propose a challenge. I do not work for any sales company but I do have a loved one that almost fell for your garbage. I researched it with and open mind because she asked me to. My mind is sealed now. I challenge you to go to Google and type in the top 100 companies in the county and then follow their name with the word scam. See how many hits you get. Then type in Primerica scam. Compare and make your decision on your own, not because I told you they are trash.
Expecting the follow up about how you help people get out of debt so that makes you walk on water. Do you charge them for the advice to get out of debt? What about the $200.00 you require for the training to become and agent?
And yes companies have VP’s everywhere. I work for a company that employs 80,000 people. We have about 100 to 200 VP’s that is a far cry from 4500.
And people VP’s don’t call you for the interview. The HR department does, don’t fall for the hype.
And Edward you are correct you can find many people like yourself and Jeremy that seem to have some cloudy positive story. Hopefully you are as honest and not “one of the bad employees”. And again you are right we have bad employees too, except we fire them when exposed! But I will make a wager we have far less of a bad employee excuse ratio than you.
Sleep well if you can.
“Expecting the follow up about how you help people get out of debt so that makes you walk on water. Do you charge them for the advice to get out of debt? What about the $200.00 you require for the training to become and agent?”
the 200 dollars charged is for the classes that you have to take. It is a pa state requirement that you take 24 hours in class training on insurance. My friends, who also got licensed to sell life insurance, had to pay 250 for their classes(they dont work for Primerica) they also had to pay $49 for the state exam and $20 for the finger prints needed to take the exam. Through Primerica i only had to pay a 200 for the classes. I recieved a check back for the cost of the exam and the finger prints. My friends did not.
the advise we give to clients is free of charge. It is called a FNA
Financial Needs Analysis
The same information provided by a company like American Express will charge upwards to $2500
Same information is provided the only difference is ours is in plain english. I have read an American Express FNA and took me a long time to fully understand it.
In response to the RVP It mainly concerns the commission rate that you receive. IT also means that at this level you are now able to not just work in one office but you are now able to own your own office as well as other offices. So yes sometimes a few RVPs to open up an office together due to the fact that it saves money.
The reason the RVP makes calls is because it is his/her business.. if you owned a business.
I actually came across this site while doing some research (with an open mind) about primerica. I can’t thank you enough for the wealth of information I have found here. My friend has just been currently sucked into one of these pyramid scams. I hope at this point she hasn’t been brainwashed enough and her mind can be changed.
I happen to know first hand WHY all of this IS a scam. It is very similar to Vector marketing which I worked for briefly as a college student. Here are the main deceptions anyone should be wary of:
1) You are your own boss! No salaries and all commission equals giving yourself a raise! NOT TRUE! If you were your own boss you could sell whatever you want. Take a look at those contracts you sign. Read all the fine print and you’ll discover how much of a cut of your commission the business takes. How you can’t take your clients when you leave. Ask this business if they give you a list of cliental. My friend proudly touted a huge list of “potential” clients. Those are referrals you solicit from your friends and family. Try calling them for an appointment and you’ll quickly find out that it’s similar to telemarketing, hit or miss (mostly miss). There is no established office for people to find you b/c “you’re your own office.” Translation: Nobody comes to us because we don’t have a solid reputation.
2) Beware of “residual income” or making money from other people’s hard work. The old saying you don’t get something for nothing is true. The company makes it seem that they just give away these huge commissions which I can’t believe anyone is taken in by. There are all these “phantom” sales people who make millions a year, only 32 and do it “part time.” Ironically they are all administration now. How convenient. They aren’t doing your grunt work anymore. Take a look around the company too. Are you working with sales people who have been doing this for ten years? Are they making hundreds of thousand a year? Although my friend pointed to several in pictures and claimed she “met” them she worked with none.
3) You have to pay them just to learn. I paid Vector for my sales kit which I needed to make demonstrations but the fees just for working there never ended. Money had to be shelled out for seminars, workshops, extra training etc. My friend has lost HUNDREDS of dollars, can only work in one place and isn’t even fully licensed yet. This is not like college where you pay for a degree and get to use it for any job. Companies are supposed to pay YOU while training you. Not the other way around.
PLEASE learn from my mistake and don’t be fooled by these guys. New college grads that are eager for the chance to succeed are the most susceptible to it. Just be patient and the right opportunity will come along to you. These quick rich schemes are just money pits.
Dear David,
if you had not wasted your time on negativity but invested your time in some honest research you would have checked out this company in a more professional manner.
Here some information for those that are interested in facts. Take a look at the following web pages and literature or if you live in the Atlanta, GA area, go and visit the Primerica headquarters at
3120 Breckinridge Boulevard
Duluth, GA 30099
Web-Sites
————–
http://www.citigroup.com – TAB Our Businesses
http://www.ambest.com – search for “primerica”
http://www.hoovers.com – search for “primerica”
http://www.dsa.org
http://www.morningstar.com – search for “primerica”
Magazines
————-
– BEST’S REVIEW – January 2005
– SUCCESS from HOME – July 2005
– FORBES GLOBAL 2000 –2005 Editon
Books
——–
– The ABCs of Making Money by Denis Cauvier, Alan Lysaght
– Start Late, Finish Rich … by David Bach
– Tearing down the walls … by Monica Langley
I was contacted Sunday night around 7 PM regarding an “interview”. This person left a message on my voicemail, how he just popped into his office and “received” my resume from monster and wanted to call me about a job opening. He gave me a cell phone number to call him back at and told me I could call him tomorrow during normal business hours. I guess that was to make it sound more official. I was already skeptical. But I did return his call Monday afternoon just to check things out. I got a generic voicemail and left a message. He again called me around 7pm that night and asked me if I was available Tuesday night(which happened to be the following day) at 7:30. Hmmm, an interview at 7:30 at night? He rambled on about a “briefing” and about opening new offices in the area and whatever. Finally, when I had the chance to cut him off, I asked what, in fact, the job was since there was no mention of this at all. He skirted that question by telling me that the company was Primerica, and something to do with Citibank and Smith Barney, yada, yada, yada, and he would get more into the job description at the “briefing”. I told him that I would see about my work schedule and try to make it. He responded that the meeting was by “invitation only” and that I should try to come and if unable to call him. He then e-mailed me directions to a warehouse office building and gave me a suite number. None of this was clicking with me so I looked the company “Primerica” up on the internet….and this, along with hundreds of other sites is what I found. I was not going to waste my time in the first place because it was fishy from the beginning. I think it is funny how the reps from Primerica get all offended that people are writing negative posts, but when you try to lure people into coming to an interview, don’t tell them what the job description is, and are just plain sneaky from the start, you can’t honestly expect to get a good reputation.
Thank you for the information. My story is the same as yours.It is actually the same story. I agreed to come to the interview basically because the representative was speaking very bad English, and I couldn’t understand most he was saying.However after he called me bunch of times during the day, and left me bunch of messages with his office number, than his cell number, i realized that he seems too desparate to get me, even though i worked all my life in production environment, and my resume stated it,and i never dealt with finances before.Well i decided to check them out on Google and here I found bunch of stories just like mine. I immediately phoned the guy, and left a message that i will unable to come for an interview. I thought this would be the end to it, but he called me an hour later and left a message that he will call me again tomorrow.This is all doesn’t seem right to me, that he is that desperate. Basically i am looking for a job to get paid, not to give my money away.In my opinion when a person looks for a job and asked to pay any fee, it should raise a red flag. Thats my story anyways.
Just because you had ONE bad experience with a company doesnt always make the WHOLE company bad. I bet you all have a family member that has done something wrong, right? well does that make YOU bad? or the whole family? Primerica has its bad apples but there are a lot of people in this business doing great!
First of all, Primerica has been around since the 1970s, have you heard of A.L. Williams or Van Campen? They are part of Primerica. Primerica is listed on the stock exchange under (c) and is part of a major company called Citigroup. Primerica has been shown in SEVERAL known business magazines such as SUCCESS magazine. Also, has done the whole magazine just on Primerica. Primerica has also paid TRILLIONS of dollars just on commission.
So if you think this is a scam and this doesn’t work, or this leaves hardships, maybe you need to do some deeper research instead of finding stuff that only REALLY reflects the financial representatives wrongdoing. This is a very huge company with lots of high companies to back it up. Do you really thing the stock exchange would have a company on there that was “fraud”? or a known business magazine company do there whole magazine just for someone who was a “scam”? Seriously people no company is perfect but a company with such high partners, you gotta tell yourself this is a good business.
Sometimes people make money from it sometimes they don’t. YOU HAVE TO WORK, you can’t just sit there and expect to get paid. Primerica doesn’t work like that when you start. OH, and the $199 fee you pay when you join is for your 52 hour class, a couple of materials and your LIFE LICENSE, where you would pay several hundreds of dollars for if you were to go somewhere else. If people didn’t do good in this business saying ” I didn’t make any money” well HELLO! you have to work at it! and it takes some time, this is the most legit business you could be in where you could be your own boss, work your own hours, get unlimited income, and not worry about getting fired or layed off. There are a lot of reps in this company who are millionaires, and no they weren’t sitting on their butts when they started, they worked hard to be at where they are today and because of that, they hardly have to work right now because of overrides and bonuses you get practically every month. If this business doesn’t work for you and you had already gotten your license, GREAT! you could work for a bank or somewhere else because you have a license!
Like a typical primerica half trained shill luvmyshay gave us several mistruths, halftruths and distortions.
For the record….A.L. Williams was the founder of primerica. Back in the day it was known as massachusetts Life and Indemnity Company. A.L. Williams Agency was who sold it. The two of them were the subject of the only “death penalty hearing” ever conducted by the State of California on a life insurance company. As a direct result California reformed many of its licensing and business guidelines.
Van Campen may be a part of primerica however Van Kampen, the mutual fund family is not. primerica, like virtually every other securities dealer in the nation has a selling agreement with van kampen to peddle their funds. Apparently luvmyshay didn’t
know the difference.
luvmyshay says primerica has paid TRILLIONS in commissions. She is off by 3 zeroes but what the heck…..whats a few zeroes among friends?
luvmyshay mentions hardships…well nothing is harder on a middle class family than falling for the primerica line of B.S. that says “interest rates don’t matter..only time in dent matters”. the $MART loans primerica peddles can easily be duplicated elsewhere while paying up to 2% less interest thus saving that family THOUSANDS…lots of THOUSANDS. TENS of THOUSANDS!!! On a $250,000 loan with a 1.25% lower interest rate than primerica offers (easy to find) the savings come to $89,000.
Primerica is a wholly owned subsidiary of Citigroup and in my humble opinion, both are cynical pirates who prey on lower middle class families who react to emotional sales pitches.
I am an 18-year-old recent high school graduate. A family friend who was an independent representative of Primerica, approached me when she decided to open her own office after only working for Primerica for a few months. She knew that I was having difficulty living off of the meager wage I was earning at my job, and the lack of hours I was recieving. She asked me if I might be interested in some part-time or full-time work at her office, that she also shares with her partner,a very successful representative of Primerica. Very interested by this proposition, I agreed to meet her to discuss the work that I would be doing. We met at Panera Bread, and over sodas, she shared with me the amazing oppurtunity that Primerica is. She offered to take me under her wing and teach me the tools I would need to learn to work with her in her office. She showed me how she made $1,300 in only two hours in commission, just by helping someone make a financial decision. She explained that I would need to pay a $200 fee to recieve my license, but after completing the course I would be refunded the full amount. The license, by the way, can still be used even if I would choose to leave Primerica. She gave me a copy of the SUCCESS from HOME magazine that ranted about the benefits of Primerica, and had many success stories. She explained the life insurance and mortgaging plans that they had available and how they would help the middle class people. I don’t know about you, but I don’t feel that someone that I know and trust would try to dupe me into falling into a pyramid scam, which by the way, she proved to me that it is not a pyramid scam. It is a way to become an independant business owner, and work from home. Independant business owners make up over 50% of the working population. And the system works just as a Mary Kay representative would make commission, and I hardly think that a bunch of women selling makeup are scam artists. It’s not a get rich quick scheme. How far you go in the company depends on the amount of effort you put into it. This is just another oppurtunity for one to work less, make money from home, and give you more time to live your life. If that doesn’t sound appealing to you, well, I hope you have enjoy working your 40+ hour job, spending hardly any time with your family, and living with the constant fear of lay-offs.
I also found this website after researching one of their Regional Vice Presidents who attempted to swindle me and my wife. I thought this essay on MLMs I found would be helpful:
MLM Watch Home Page
Ten Big Lies of Multilevel Marketing
Robert L. Fitzpatrick
The multilevel marketing (MLM) field grows, and its member companies multiply. Solicitations to join seem to be everywhere. Its promoters would like you to believe that it is the wave of the future, a business model that is gaining momentum, growing in acceptance and legitimacy, and will eventually replace most other forms of marketing. Many people are led to believe that success will come to anyone who believes in the system and adheres to its methods.
Unfortunately, the MLM business model is a hoax that is hidden beneath misleading slogans. Calling it a “great business opportunity” makes no more sense than calling the purchase of a lottery ticket a “business venture” and winning the lottery a “viable income opportunity for everyone.” MLM industry claims of distributor income potential, its glorified descriptions of the “network'” business model, and its prophecies of dominating product distribution have as much validity in business as UFO sightings do in the realm of science.
The very legality of the MLM system rests tenuously upon a single 1979 court ruling on one company. The guidelines for legal operation set forth in that ruling are routinely ignored by the industry. Lack of governing legislation or oversight by any designated authority also enables the industry to endure despite occasional prosecutions by state attorneys general or the FTC.
MLM’s economic scorecard is characterized by massive failure rates and financial losses for millions of people. Its structure in which positions on an endless sales chain are purchased by selling or buying goods is mathematically unsustainable, and its system of allowing unlimited numbers of distributors in any market area is inherently unstable. MLM’s espoused core business — personal retailing — is contrary to trends in communication technology, cost-effective distribution, and consumer buying preferences. The retailing activity is, in reality, only a pretext for the actual core business, which is enrolling investors in pyramid organizations that promise exponential income growth.
As in all pyramid schemes, the incomes of those distributors at the top and the profits to the sponsoring corporations come from a continuous influx of new investors at the bottom. Viewed superficially in terms of company profits and the wealth of an elite group at the pinnacle of the MLM industry, the model can appear viable to the uninformed, just as all pyramid schemes do before they collapse or are prosecuted by authorities.
The growth of MLM is the result of deceptive marketing that plays upon treasured cultural beliefs, social and personal needs, and some economic trends, rather than its ability to meet any consumer needs. The deceptive marketing is nurtured by a general lack of professional evaluation or investigation by reputable business media. Consequently, there is widespread belief that MLM is a viable business investment or career choice for nearly everyone and that the odds of financial success in the venture are comparable or better than other employment or business ventures.
MLM’s true constituency is not the consuming public but hopeful investors. The market for these investors grows significantly in times of economic transition, globalization, and employee displacement. Promises of quick and easy financial deliverance and the linking of wealth to ultimate happiness also play well in this market setting. The marketing thrust of MLM is directed to prospective distributors, rather than product promotions to purchasers. Its true products are not long distance phone services, vitamins, or skin creams, but the investment propositions for distributorships which are deceptively portrayed with images of high income, low time requirements, small capital investments, and early success.
Here are ten lies I have identified during more than 20 years of observing the MLM marketplace:
Lie #1: MLM offers better opportunities than all other conventional
business and professional models for making large amounts of money.
Truth: For almost everyone who invests, MLM turns out to be a losing financial proposition. Fewer than 1% of all MLM distributors ever earn a profit and those earning a sustainable living at this business are a much smaller percentage still.
Extraordinary sales and marketing obstacles account for much of this failure, but even if the business were more feasible, sheer mathematics would severely limit the opportunity. The MLM business structure can support only a small number of financial winners. If a 1,000-person downline is needed to earn a sustainable income, those 1,000 will need one million more to duplicate the success. How many people can realistically be enrolled? Much of what appears as growth is in fact only the continuous churning of new enrollees. The money for the rare winners comes from the constant enrollment of armies of losers. With no limits on numbers of distributors in an area and no evaluation of market potential, the system is also inherently unstable.
Lie #2: Network marketing is the most popular and effective new way to bring products
to market. Consumers like to buy products on a one-to-one basis in the MLM model.
Truth: Personal retailing — including nearly all forms of door-to-door selling — is a thing of the past, not the wave of the future. Retailing directly to friends on a one-to-one basis requires people to drastically change their buying habits. They must restrict their choices, often pay more for goods, buy inconveniently, and engage in potentially awkward business relationships with close friends and relatives. In reality, MLM depends on reselling the opportunity to sign up more distributors.
Lie #3: Eventually all products will be sold by MLM. Retail stores, shopping malls,
catalogs and most forms of advertising will soon be rendered obsolete by MLM.
Truth: Fewer than 1% of all retail sales are made through MLM, and much of this is consists of purchases by hopeful new distributors who are actually paying the price of admission to a business they will soon abandon. MLM is not replacing existing forms of marketing. It does not legitimately compete with other marketing approaches at all. Rather, MLM represents a new investment scheme couched in the language of marketing. Its real products are distributorships that are sold through misrepresentation and exaggerated promises of income. People are buying products in order to secure positions on the sales pyramid. The possibility is always held out that you may become rich if not from your own efforts then from some unknown person (“the big fish”) who might join your “downline.”
MLM’s growth does not reflect its value to the economy, customers, or distributors, but the high levels of economic fear, insecurity, wishes for quick and easy wealth. The market dynamics are similar to those of legalized gambling, but the percentage of winners is much smaller.
Lie #4: MLM is a new way of life that offers happiness and fulfillment.
It provides a way to attain all the good things in life.
Truth: The most prominent motivational themes of the MLM industry, as shown in industry literature and presented at recruitment meetings, constitute the crassest form of materialism. Fortune 100 companies would blush at the excess of promises of wealth, luxury, and personal fulfillment put forth by MLM solicitors. These appeals actually conflicts with most people’s true desire for meaningful and fulfilling work at something in which they have special talent or interest.
Lie #5: MLM is a spiritual movement.
Truth: The use of spiritual concepts like prosperity consciousness and creative visualization to promote MLM enrollment, the use of words like “communion” to describe a sales organization, and claims that MLM fulfills Christian principles or Scriptural prophecies are great distortions of these spiritual practices. Those who focus their hopes and dreams upon wealth as the answer to their prayers lose sight of genuine spirituality as taught by religions. The misuse of these spiritual principles should be a signal that the investment opportunity is deceptive. When a product is wrapped in the flag or in religion, buyer beware! The “community” and “support” offered by MLM organizations to new recruits is based entirely upon their purchases. If the purchases and enrollment decline, so does the “communion.'”
Lie #6: Success in MLM is easy. Friends and relatives are the natural prospects.
Those who love and support you will become your life-time customers.
Truth: The commercialization of family and friendship and the use of”‘warm leads” advocated in MLM marketing programs are a destructive element in the community and very unhealthy for individuals involved. People do not appreciate being pressured by friends and relatives to buy products. Trying to capitalizing upon personal relationships to build a business can destroy one’s social foundation.
Lie #7: You can do MLM in your spare time. As a business, it offers the greatest flexibility
and personal freedom of time. A few hours a week can earn a significant supplemental income
and may grow to a very large income, making other work unnecessary.
Truth: Making money in MLM requires extraordinary time commitment as well as considerable personal skill and persistence. Beyond the sheer hard work and talent required, the business model inherently consumes more areas of one’s life and greater segments of time than most occupations. In MLM, everyone is a prospect. Every waking moment is a potential time for marketing. There are no off-limit places, people, or times for selling. Consequently, there is no free space or free time once a person enrolls in MLM system. While claiming to offer independence, the system comes to dominate people’s entire life and requires rigid conformity to the program. This is why so many people who become deeply involved end up needing and relying upon MLM desperately. They alienate or abandon other sustaining relationships.
Lie #8. MLM is a positive, supportive new business that
affirms the human spirit and personal freedom.
Truth: MLM is largely fear-driven. Solicitations inevitably include dire predictions about the impending collapse of other forms of distribution, the disintegration or insensitivity of corporate America, and the lack of opportunity in other occupations. Many occupations are routinely demeaned for not offering”unlimited income.” Working for others is cast as enslavement for “losers.” MLM is presented as the last best hope for many people. This approach, in addition to being deceptive, frequently discourages people who otherwise would pursue their own unique visions of success and happiness. A sound business opportunity does not have to base its worth on negative predictions and warnings.
Lie #9. MLM is the best option for owning your own
business and attaining real economic independence.
Truth: MLM is not true self-employment. “Owning” an MLM distributorship is an illusion. Some MLM companies forbid distributors to carry other companies’ products. Most MLM contracts make termination of the distributorship easy and immediate for the company. Short of termination, downlines can be taken away arbitrarily. Participation requires rigid adherence to a “duplication” model, not independence and individuality. MLM distributors are not entrepreneurs but joiners in a complex hierarchical system over which they have little control.
Lie #10: MLM is not a pyramid scheme because products are sold.
Truth: The sale of products does not protect against anti-pyramid-scheme laws or unfair trade practices set forth in federal and state law. MLM is a legal form of business only under rigid conditions set forth by the FTC and state attorneys general. Many MLMs are violate these guidelines and operate only because they have not been prosecuted. Recent court rulings are using a 70% rule to determine an MLM’s legality: At least 70% of all goods sold by the MLM company must be purchased by nondistributors. This standard would place most MLM companies outside the law. The largest MLM acknowledges that only 18% of its sales are made to nondistributors.
Accountability Needed
An FTC trade regulation rule that forces honest disclosure of potential MLM distributor income is desperately needed. Toward this end, Pyramid Scheme Alert has launched a petition drive urging the FTC to force multilevel companies to disclose the true income of their distributors. The requested data would include: (a) the total number of distributors involved in the company for at least three years (or since the company’s founding if less than three years); (b) the average incomes of all distributors who have signed up for a distributorship by percentiles, not just the ones deemed “active”; and (c) a “weighted” overall average income of all distributors so that the extraordinary high incomes of the small number at the top are not calculated in with vast majority so as to give a more statistically valid figure.
_________________
Mr. FitzPatrick consults and writes about trends in manufacturer/distributor relationships. He founded and is president of Pyramid Scheme Alert, a consumer advocacy group focused on exposing and preventing pyramid schemes. He has served as an expert witness in several cases involving pyramid schemes and MLM companies. He writings include False Profits (a book about MLM deception) and “Pyramid Nation” (a booklet that laments the growth and “legalization” of pyramid schemes.)
MLM Watch Home Page
YOU GUYS WOULD NEVER BELEIVE THIS! OMG! I JUST FOUND THIS OUT YESTERDAY! NOT EVERYTHING YOU READ ONLINE IS TRUE! It’s so mindboggling!
Here’s a thought, I don’t care WHAT company you’re researching, you can type the name of it in a google search and NO MATTER WHO it is, I guarantee you can find PLENTY of disgruntled ex employees or someone that got taken advantage of, or someone that had a bad run in. ALL companies face this.
Here’s another thought. Primerica is the NUMBER 1 term insurance writer in the country. They are backed and owned by the LARGEST company in the world, Citigroup. They have over a billion in assets.
And if anyone puts any PROPER research in, the HIGHEST fine that Primerica has EVER paid in it’s 30 year history was $1300 in Utah.
I realize there are bad reps. And for the person that said they have bad employees too but they fire them…Primerica ALSO dismisses people if they find out they are not representing the company in the proper manner.
Oh, and one more thought. Did you know the insurance company actually PAYS people to go out and write bad things about their competition online. Not just Primerica but ALL their competition.
It’s not even worth my time to go over all the other obvious mis-steps that you “researchers” have talked about.
I agree with Lyn. Yes, Primerica does have a few bad seeds, just like everyone else. Fortunately they are easily weeded out, either through the company termination by not following through Primerica’s compliance or that people can easily see through the deception so they make no money(then they log on here and say I made no money and its a scam..lol). So far, I’ve seen 4 agents terminated for doing dishonest things in the last 8 months. When you get involved in a company like this, just DO THE RIGHT THING. People know through body language and the way you talk whether or not you’re sincere.
About doing research on companies, please quit going to websites like these. It took me 6 steps, about 20 seconds, to register on this website to write this post. Primerica’s competition, disgruntled agents, or people who just did lack of research love to spread rumors, and what better place than the internet? Almost at an instant I could write on here that someone could be a whore. If you do your “research”, take diligence. People figure just opening google and typing w/e will get them the right information. Would you do that when or if you just had a child and she had a sickness that you didnt know and try to diagnose it yourself by looking up information on google? You must be insane if you have. Regardless, do your research from the feds or other reputable reporting companies (not websites where it takes 30 seconds to create a sn and start posting garbage).
Oh, one more thing. That $200 Primerica asks for? I can’t imagine that would even be an issue for the large amount of education you would learn, and also getting a free license? If you have an issue with $200 then maybe you should really manage your money better some how some way if you’re not going to get assistance from Primerica. I mean, if you don’t have $200 then how are you going to afford a plan from Edward Jones, which only covers the areas of investments. Besides, I much rather pay $200 dollars to make as much as my 4 year bachelors in computer science that cost me over $50,000. Sad enough that degree doesn’t guarantee a high paying job. I landed $40,000 a year salarie, but stuck there and virtually hit my ceiling. And only after 8 months working with Primerica, DOING the right things, brings home just as much, but half the time. I won’t say its easy, but nothing worth having comes easy.
Enough of my ranting. Its your life, do what you wish.
For anyone who would like to understand the company there is a book that
Will be hitting the shelves soon it is call
COACH (the art Williams story. how one man revolutionized the entire insurance industry)
If you have the time to sit in front of your computer and read all this
propaganda from all these sites that are not even compliant approved, then
go to your local book store, were they also have Starbuck and tables grab the
book COACH and start reading it, you will be amazed and will have a
different opinion. Oh and by the way if you notice I also said sit down have
a cup of Joe and read the book, see if you don’t leave the store you didn’t
even reach in you pocket to by the book. I don’t want anyone thinking I am
trying to scam them out of there $10 or $20 dollars the book cost.
Remember one thing when you have a passion for something you know you
are doing right it really does not matter what everyone else says. When I first
came to this business the money caught my eye. Now only a little over a
year into this great company I know I speak for many of us, I would walk
away from my current 6 figure income and do this for free know the value I
bring to families.
If you want the truth about the company you don’t listen to someone who
quit because he was not tough enough, therefore if you research the person
who quit, most likely he quit everything he ever tried or even thought of.
They are probably on there 2nd, 3rd or even 4th job that they even quit. Oh!
By the way, there was probably something wrong with everyone else at
those jobs not them.
I love you all
God-Family-business-freedom
See you at the top
Primerica is a PROVEN business system…not a pyramid. First of all, a pyramid is an illegal operation – why would the worlds largest financial institution (Citibank) allow its name to be associated with anything that was not completely legitimate? Secondly, as I said, it is a BUSINESS SYSTEM…set up much like a realty company or a mortgage office…there are representatives who make sales and the broker overrides their sales, making a commission off of their production. The difference is, with Primerica, instead of creating your competition who will go out and open their own realty office, you are building your very own branch office…even when you promote people out from your office into their own, you still receive a small amount of override as long as they are producing. There is nothing illegal about this…it’s called good business. And it’s true that there are about 4500 RVP’s in our company…did he also tell you our company has more million dollar earners than all of the top companies on the Dow 100 combined? Don’t get me wrong, this is a tough business. You have to have a good bit of tenacity to make it…but most of all, you have to have a winners mindset. People with the quitter’s mindset will never make it in Primerica. They will stay quitters and just blame Primerica for their problems.
test
Does Primerica Really Help People?
My friend just started “working” for primerica a few weeks ago. His “manager” advised him to try and sell the products to his friends and family. So, he did a financial needs analysis and here was the outcome. He refinanced his parents mortgage to consolidate 10k in Credit Card debt. He pushed their interest rate on their mortgage from 6 to 9.5% and the kicker…Primerica charged 6k in fees to do the loan. Essentially they paid a 6k to consolidate 10k in debt and increased their rate on the mortgage by 3.5 percent.
Bottom line.
Primerica is a scam and they do not train their agents mortgage fundamentals. The funniest thing about this situation is that the agent actually thought that he helped his parents!
I know a couple of people in Primerica, and I think you are stretching to call it a scam. They have an excellent suite of financial services, from loans to consolidation to mortages to 401k’s to IRA’s to money markets to mutual funds, etc, all under the Citigroup umbrella – which gives them a big advantage over the individual financial advisors. An individual advisor could have some of your money with company A, stocks with company B, mutual funds with company C, etc…where Primerica just punches your needs into a computer and it all happens underneath Citigroup (which is the #2 financial company in the world).
I am not a total homer here…there are negatives. As many have mentioned, the company itself is built in the pyramid mold, where sales agents get paid for business they do, but ultimately can get paid more for recruiting people to get into the business. You get promoted by getting more people and meeting goals and such, so agents obviously are motivated to bring people in as well as do business with you. RVP/VP is just their
“title” to give to people who have moved up high enough by recruiting people, doing business, and moving to full-time.
My experience with them has been great because they aren’t pushy with me or anything to join (since I know them), but I have definitely heard many stories of bad apples coming in either from recruiting or just by chance, and it goes from there. Kind of echoing AJ’s point above – there isn’t a major amount of training needed to actually get into Primerica (just basically get licensed for insurance and securities in your state), so it’s easy for uneducated and non-sales-minded (i.e. bad with people) people to get into the organization and really give it a bad name.
There’s two lines to draw here though. Their services are very good and I’d definitely recommend them. They give all their financial advice for free (and like I said their services are really awesome), they usually just try to get referrals from you. Meeting with a financial advisor is usually upwards of 2500 bucks so you can’t go wrong there. And heck if you like their packages you can ask them about joining up as well so you can get a cut of any referrals you give…which is nice. However, the 2nd part is the recruiting. If agents are promising you big money to work there and all the stuff that’s synonomous with pyramid schemes, that really sucks. The company itself is supposed to be about helping regular people with their finances (like the people above that work there seem to confirm) – not being sleazy pushy salesmen. I think that’s a big problem with them is allowing the individual agents to have so much control. There’s no “manager” out there that can fire the people that are acting like jerks since everyone works for themselves…and that’s what can easily tarnish their image.
I got sucked into an interview at Primerica last year. I was working at my old job when a woman came up to me, told me that I looked and acted very professional and gave me her husbands business card. She said he was hiring and that I should give him a call. The card said “Citi” on it (no mention of Primerica) so I was kind of excited that I could get a good job at what I perceived to be a good firm. I called the guy and he sounded excited to talk to me and told me to hurry in for an interview. He wanted me there so fast it was a real pain but I went ahead and agreed to meet. The place was over an hour from my home and I had to drive through horrendous traffic. When I arrived at the “suite,” they made me wait over an hour and fill out a lot of documents (Luckily I left all of my important data blank from the sheet). Anyway, I had the interview and from the way the guy talked, I knew it was too good to be true. He gave me this huge spiel about debt, asked me about my own debt and told me all about how debt was the ruin of American society. This guy asked me if I could come back again, that evening, at 7:30 to attend a very special meeting with one of the “Presidents” of Primerica. He said the guy flew in and was only gonna be hiring for one night. He then asked me if I was a Christian–which I refused to answer and was offended.
I realized this guy was full of it and left, lying to him about returning that evening (He left 5 voicemails when I refused to answer). I was so pissed this guy wasted my whole afternoon and two hours in horrible traffic.
I would advise any and EVERYONE to avoid Primerica–Its a total scam.
AJ — 9.5 % was probably better
That’s the problem with middle income families we’ve been brainwashed to ask the wrong questions.
1) What is my interest rate?
2) What is my monthly payment?
What you show ask is.
1) What is the ACTUAL total cost of my loan?
2) And when will It be payed off?
All interest does is calculates your payment.
For you researchers find out the diffrence between (Citi Corp Trust)Daily computed cycle morgage and a 30 day precomputed cycle morgage.
I just got done going back with a client tonight with a 6.25 interest rate and 26 years left on their morgage.
Did our S.M.A.R.T. Loan (daily computed cycle), eliminated all their debt and they’ll be paying their house off in 15 years and 7 months plus saving them $542 a month. And guess what their interest rate is 10.4 percent.
I have been involved with primerica about 8 months now and i believe it is the BEST AND GREATEST Opportunity out there!!! You can’t tell me getting somebody out of debt, helping save there money for retirement, and properly protecting that wealth is a scam?? you guys are IDIOTS!!! I come from a proffesion that was paying me six figures and gladly gave that up to help people with this!!! PEOPLE NEED WHAT WE DO!!! Just because you don’t have the Balls to go work and make something of yourself isnt our problem!!!another thing is you have Primerica which is a division of Citigroup, Citigroup is the LARGEST FINACIAL GROUP in the WORLD!!! They must be doing something right!!! do credible research and you will see everybody need what we do!!! If you don’t you deserve what you get!!!
I just had a guy call saying he liked my resume as he found it on Monster and he is with Primerica and will be expanding into the Flint, MI area soon. He asked if I was interested in a job if the salary was right. I said “yes”. He then mentioned if I was okay with a commission job, to which I said “yes”. Then he said that he rented a hall at the Residence Inn on US23/Hill Rd for 7:00 for Wed 18th Oct 2006…to which I asked 7:00am and he said “yes”. He said he would email me the details and for me to respond to his email so he knows that I got it. Thus far no email has come in. I went online and did a search and guess what they sound fishy in the way they hire. Sorry but I don’t HAVE to work so I am not planning to waste my time (looking to just get out of the house some during the week). Plus one thing I know from running business is you never do business with family and if they want me to sell to family forget it.
IMHO………you can position it any way you want but Primerica will have a tougher time with the FTC New Business Opportunity rule. On the Federal Gov FTC site, you can view comments that were made during the comments period and Primerica reps are bit worried. Why would anyone be against proposed rules such as:
The proposed FTC rule would not require any business opportunity seller to make an earnings claim. However, if they did make an earnings claim, they would be required to provide additional substantiation in the form of an “Earnings Claims Statement.”
The proposed rule also would prohibit unfair or deceptive practices that are common among fraudulent business opportunity sellers, including:
misrepresentations about the material terms of the business relationship; the use of shills; misrepresentations of endorsements or testimonials; failure to honor territorial protection guarantees; and failure to honor refunds.
I would guess the part about “Earnings Claims Statement” has them worried. Telling a new recruit that they have a 95% chance of not making that 6 figure income isn’t a good selling point. Heck I’ve read that their chance could be 98% that they won’t make the 6 figure income.
Why in the world does Primerica have a non-compete clause. If Primerica was paying workers comp., FICA, FUTA etc., if Primerica was paying for advertising, if Primerica was paying for you to have an office to sit and answer incoming calls from their advertising, I could understand a non-compete. After all the firm would have spent a lot of money to bring business to you. Instead Primerica leaves it all up to the rep., finding clients, etc. Unsuspecting people end up signing contracts, possibly people that have never reviewd a contract in their entire life. With trust of the person that brought them to the “opportunity” they sign these contracts.
You are not an Independent Agent. If you think you are one, just try contracting with other insurance companies and see how long Primerica will keep you as a contracted agent. You’ll quickly find out that you aren’t an independent agent.
I do wonder how Primerica circumvents the Statutory Employee definition. Due to the Primerica contract controlling who the agent can sell insurance for, who really owns the clients, and is therefore under the control of Primerica my State Workers Comp board said a judge may find that a Primerica agent is an employee, not an independent contractor. This is a scenario the board gave to me: You get hurt while selling insurance, your health carrier denies the claim because it happened during employment, you then file a workers comp claim and it will eventually end up before a workers comp judge. That judge may very well consider it an employee / employer relationship.
Does Primerica inform their agents to tell their auto insurer that the car will be used in a business venture? Have an accident in the course of going to see a prospect, it goes to court, your auto insureer could deny coverage.
Does Primerica inform their agents that they should have E&O (Errors and Ommissions) insurance? Doubt it. But without it, the Primerica agent gets sued and they have no defense coverage nor claims paying coverage.
So we see Primerica wants to only show one side of the business of selling insurance. That one side looks warm, fuzzy and lucrative. The realty may be different but it is lucrative for those up-line people.
IMHO…..
Here’s what I learned with 9 years at pfs…..
CAPTIVE AGENT ….so much for independent agent. You could sell only Citi products..Sign up with another carrier and see how fast you are sent a YOU ARE IN VIOLATION OF PFS COMPANY AGREEMENTS and given 30 days to show proof you have left them other companies. A true INDEPENDENT can sell for whomever they choose and do what is right for the client 100% of the time.
Insurance agents are allowed to sell annuities, but not at PFS…Only Travelers VARIABLE annuities(oops, NOW METLIFE)Oh, by the way, does the average PFS agent know that you were almost sold to Met, but they didn’t want you. Also, did you know that you were almost sold to AIG through the Travelers deal, but they didn’t want you either. How about a recorded tape of a SNSD who says to get all you can from PFS in the next two years, cause Citi doesn’t know how long they want to keep you..(2005)..hmmm..What do they know that the little guy doesn’t…
KNOWLEDGE is NOT POWER….The new advisor rules came into fruition in 2005, pfs would not allow you to take the series 65 exam.(The financial Advisor exam)this is why they changed the Callatlanta software in 2005…Also, if and when you decide to leave PFS and you have a securities license(I did..6,63,26), try to find a place in the financial services arena that will accept the experience with PFS…First question they ask is what was your GDC(gross dealers concession)..They laugh when you tell them you earned $32000 on $2.3 million in mutual funds…The industry is $68,000…the rest went ot your uplines…..(above RVP, by the way) and if you have had a bankruptcy, hide it from the NASD, or they won’t approve you…(great advice ,by the way) It will be OK though, you will get paid a referral fee for securities sales(ILLEGAL!!!!!!!!!)
LIABILITIES: If the average pfs agent would understand the downfall of not having E&O insurance, they would not sale the over-priced term insurance. Make a mistake and see who gets dragged into court, not PFS, YOU do..
UNCOMPETITIVE: Selling overpriced insurance in comparison to the industry. go to ANY quote engine on the net and type in the face amount of your policy,age and rating and compare what you pay to what is out there…BIG difference…
INTERNAL CONSUMPTION: the growth factor. Most agents are required to buy, did I say that?, coerced to buy, their own policies…
Let’s see 50 recruits this month X 50 new policies = HUGE bonus for VP next month….
Overpriced loan program: Selling the 10.5% rate on a 30 year fixed,with an effective rate of 6.45%(don’t use effective rate in public, cause it is illegal to use it)
My personal history with the loan program….Case #1
Client has a home valued at $45,000 (appraised by PFS company).
They owe $29,000 on it, $6000 on car, and $7500 in credit card debt. Total monthly savings of $210 with loan program offered by PFS. 10.5% note rate, doing biweekly it is paid off in 19 years..Looks great, RIGHT???
WRONG!!!!! Client had a 798 beacon score. The true value of home was $94,000.(County auditor had it pegged at $92,000) They qualified for a 5.625 Note rate for 20 years, with biweekly thru CW, home was paid for in 16 years and saved $410/month. THIS was the LOAN that was given to my mother……….Imagine sleeping at night after you find that out…You took an app for a stupid contest and screwed your own mother………If you are taking the loan apps now, ask to see the clients credit scores.a nono at pfs, due to privacy? have your client call and ask the scores…another nono..DON’t ever give the SOLUTION center phone number out!!!!!! Ask if the solution center can use an outside appraiser….another nono….Have to be approved by Citi…Ask what is the total cost of my loan? Compare that to any bank today and you will truly see the difference.
OWNING YOUR BUSINESS….
You own your business from day one, right? WRONG..read the fine print of your contract…upon resignation or termination, please return the following to your upline
manager..Client files, rolodex cards, life apps being held, iba’s being held, trade blotters, trade secrets….
Also, no solicitation of business from prior clients for up to 7 years with your new company…or agents in your downlines…don’t let them know of the truths or it
is considered slander and you will end up in federal court…
A true independent doesn’t have to GIVE UP half their organization to go to senior management…Ask your upline NOW if you have to give up half your team (replacementor management exchange)
to get the higher contracts. If so, it might be a great time to rethink your position.
Anyways, I could go on and on, but why? This was personal experience at PFS, (yes, I have documents to support all item listed above) for nine years, 5 as a RVP. Today, I run a profitable NON_CAPTIVE agency that puts the client first…Commission is not the mission anymore……….
http://video.google.com/videosearch?q=primerica
Need I say more?
I wish people would stop and look at the positive side of Primerica, because we do help people and change their lifes. Checkout these sights. Life is all about being positive not negative!!
http://www.oneteamonedream.biz/siteredesign/index.asp
https://www.growingattitudes.com/
http://www.shanerudman.com/
http://www.primericabusinessopportunity.com/
http://www.primericafna.com/
https://primerica.impress-net.com/secure/login.asp
http://www.primericaaalc.com/
http://www.womeninprimerica.com/
http://www.primericafinancialsolutions.com/
http://ww4.primerica.com/public/
http://ww2.shareholder.primerica.com/public/shareholder/
I’m so tired of people putting down Primerica. You didn’t waste an hour, you gained some valuable information about savings and retirement. You’d recomemnd a movie or a good restaurant to your friends, but when it comes to a good company with sound finacial advice you call it a scam.
Geez, Dave.. way to stir things up!
Quick question for those involved in Primerica. [DISCLAIMER: I am seriously asking this question, as I have not made up my mind either way about the validity of Primerica].
Whew… okay now to the question…
Has anyone involved in Primerica seen the “financial benefit” of being “an independent business owner” to the degree of the testimonials they had been told?
Here’s why I’m asking. I have a friend who has been involved with Primerica for quite some time. At the beginning he was quite passionate [almost fanatical] about Primerica. Lately he;s been telling me how although he still enjoys help families, he is still “waiting” for this to be the financial windfall that he was promised. In fact, he;s still barely keeping his head above water.
Does this resonate with anyone else?
1-20-2007
I went to one of those interviews for primerica too. I’m not saying they are a bad company, they probably are good to their clients. They’re were so many red flags at that meeting and any “educated” person would have been very cautious before considering employment with them. Well unfortunately most of the people either had minimal education or were working in an unrelated field. Primerica seem to have good products, so why do they need to bring in groups and groups of people to work.
I tell you what my concerns were and why I walked away.
-They didn’t care if you had any business or financial background.
-They talked in circles saying the same thing in different and more exciting way.
-They never clarified how the commissions worked exactly or where they came from, but were sure to let you about how big your commission would be per family (which made me think how much of deal are these middle class families really getting)
-They are the middle man, if families cut out the middle man and went directly to the source of the funding they could save more.
-They told me I would need $199 for licensures (not a problem), but why didn’t they tell me up front before I wasted an hour of my time. (My time is important to me).
-they don’t advertise, they say they are word of mouth and there is the catch. If there are 100 employee (or little worker ants I like to call them) scrambling around talking to people, leaving info., and saying good things about Primerica then that is the word of mouth. That sales person might talk to 20 people before he gets just one to be his client. But those 20 all talk to other people and some of those people are either going to look into it or some of the original 20 are going to change their mind. Who are they going to call probably right to the primerica office bypassing that poor sales person. So the big bosses who are there collect the prize. (They make sure to offer something for free so it may make that person call Primerica later to look into that free info.)
-they didn’t say exactly where you would work, from an office, from home, what I think is they teach you enough to be in the field, but not enough to do what they do.
-The most troublesome reason I walked away was because they didn’t have anything in writing, not one thing, not a mission statement, not even a little scrap of paper-Nothing.
I work for Primerica. In my first 2 months I was able to obtain two promotions. I do not feel the need to defend the company;we are doing just fine without the business of folks like you. I just decided to search the web for these so called “negative” sites. I really do not understand how people can not see the good that we do for people. If you are willing to devote the proper amount of attention to your work you really do make the money that you hear about! The one catch is that you have to have a good heart. We do not offer any of our products to clients unless they make an improvement on that clients financial situation. A good hearted person does wonderful things for others. Primerica is a great opportunity for everyone. I encourage anyone who has read this blog to find a local primerica office, and go to a meeting or just call to talk to the rvp. They will answer your questions. Don’t listen to such false claims. Find out first hand for yourself. The worst that can happen is that you find out you were wrong, and that Primerica is a company that could help you!
Primerica is all about helping people. They have helped my own situation out far better than any other financial adviser. I did my research and the more research I did I found out I loved the company more and more. Because they helped me out and they help families out.After alot of research I decided to join the company. And the 200 dollars that you pay to join. You are starting your own business you are not paying for your job you are paying to start your own job. That 200 dollars goes to pay for your training course. Where anyone else that wants to get licensed pays the very same fees.All these negative comments are about how they have been recruited and ill admit it not everyone is perfect for this business. But there is nothing negative mentioned about how bad their products are WHY Because there amazing!
So many of the negative people quote ripoffreport.com for their “facts” about Primerica.
Might I suggest that they all visit the ripoffreport.com website, and read the incredible retraction they have recently posted about their negative comments. They took the time to do what others don’t – they did their own research, and found quite a different company from the one described by those who merely seek to perpetrate and perpetuate lies and mistruths.
These lies usually come from one of two places: 1. Other financial companies and 2. People who just couldn’t cut it in Primerica. Hey,if they couldn’t make it here, it’s not the fault of the company – it’s time to look in the mirror and accept some personal responsibility.
Not everyone is cut out for this type of business, and that’s ok. But geez, don’t blame the company – it’s just not the correct fit for them.
And I agree – there are people in our company who do give it a bad name thru their actions. Quite frankly, they don’t belong here, and I apologize to those of you who unfortunately experienced one of our bad examples.
For whatever reasons they might have, they feel that they need to do those things, which only hurt the more ethical ones of us. Again, my apologies for their stupid behaviors and shortcomings.
However, you cannot argue with the company’s intentions, or the value of the products we offer.
If someone wants to go out and get the mortgage with the lowest interest rate, they’re certainly free to do so. You see, I don’t know about you, but I don’t pay my mortgage with an interest rate – I pay it with dollars.
And I would rather possibly have a higher interest rate, if it means that I’ll be out of debt faster, and save 10’s of thousands of dollars in interest over the course of the loan, thru the use of a true bi-weekly payment program.
Oh, your bank or mortgage company might offer you a bi-weekly program, but here’s how it will work (and if you don’t believe me, I challenge you to check it out with your own mortgage company – call them and ask them):
1) They’ll want to charge you a fee to set it up, probably around $299
2) They’ll want to charge you a few bucks every 2 weeks when they transfer your money (1/2 of your monthly payment, every 2 weeks)
3) But, here’s the kicker – ask them when your first 1/2 payment will actually applied to the loan.
I’ll bet the ranch that they’ll tell you that they’ll hold the 1st 1/2 payment until they get the 2nd one, then they’ll apply the 2 of them together, as one monthly payment, ON THE REGULAR MONTHLY DUE-DATE! It doesn’t get applied any earlier!
Now,in fairness, you will get your mortgage paid off earlier than the original number of years, because you’ll be making 26 1/2 payments in 12 months, one every 2 weeks, which equals 13 monthly payments.
However, it gets paid off even faster, which means paying less in interest, when the payments are applied when they actually come in, and are not held until another one is received.
It’s called “Simple Interest” (ours), as opposed to “Scheduled Interest” (theirs). So, go ahead – call your bank and find out!
You see, if people would only take the time to understand the difference it makes when a payment is applied to the mortgage balance when it is received, lowering the principal balance at that time, having the loan then reamortize every time a payment is received, they’d also go for the higher rate.
And, we don’t charge you to set it up, you don’t pay a fee to us when the money is transferred every 2 weeks – and, of course, the payments are applied when received.
So, do I care if the interest rate might be higher, if I’m saving thousands in interest dollars?
Heck, no!!!
It’s all about choices – people should at least attempt to get all the information they can, to be able to make the best choices.
But, as is said, “Ignorance is bliss”. And,that’s really a shame, because they end up paying so much more in interest dollars over the course of paying off the loan.
And, someone incorrectly mentioned this – no, we are not limited to just our own products. We actually market the mutual funds of many of the top financial companies available, such as Aim, American Funds, Fidelity Advisor, Van Kampen, Oppenheimer, MFS, Franklin/Templeton, Putnam.
And, guess what – we don’t get paid more to market the fund families we are directly associated with. It’s the same, right across the board.
We are right now in the process of adding Homeowners and Auto insurances to our product line (it’s being test-marketed in selected areas), and we will be using around a dozen different companies, to assure that we will be able to come up with the correct plan for our clients.
We focus on doing what’s best for our clients, by analyzing their entire financial situation thru the use of a complimentary “Financial Needs Analysis”. I don’t market loans, or insurances, or investments – I work with people to develop a plan to help them hopefully straighten out their current financial situation, then allowing them to work on putting things in place for the future.
We’re part of a very large company called Citigroup – but that doesn’t mean I can help everyone. I can’t, and I let people know that up front. I don’t carry a magic wand. Not everyone is in a position to be helped, and not everyone wants my help. And that’s just fine with me, should they choose to not work with me. That’s their choice.
But,to the families where we can make a difference, the results can be incredible.
I said before that I don’t market products, and I don’t – I market hope and opportunity to those who appreciate such things.
And,I don’t focus on trying to recruit every person that breathes, because that can lead to the type of situation that you unfortunately experienced.
Most of us are not like that – those people are a very small minority. Most of us are highly ethical, moral people with integrity, and all we want is to be able to help people succeed – both our clients, and those who choose to part of our business, even on a part-time basis.
This business is not for everyone, but everyone does have a chance for success here.
This business is for the right person,at the right time, and for the right reasons – theirs, not mine.
We work together with our people, and in my opinion, we should always focus on their needs over our own, whether they are a client or a business partner.
I encourage you, and everyone else, to do your own research, and not let one unfortunate experience with one wrong person, possibly get in the way of a real, bonafide chance for yourself.
If nothing else, everyone please go to the ripoffreport.com website, to see what they have to say now, after researching Primerica for themselves.
That way, you don’t have to continue to be part of an ugly situation, only made uglier when the lies and untruths continue to be spread.
You can make a difference!
Thanks for the time, and thanks for listening!
Alan Linett, RVP Primerica Financial Services
Why you would do your research on the internet, it’s not regulated. Their is more complaint about “GOD” than Primerica. The only research you need to do is to call you bank and ask for a balance.
Here’s the DEAL:
I have read a lot of emotionally charged posts, and I would like to balance those with this.
FACT: Primerica is not a scam, pyramid or otherwise. However they do perform a tightrope act as they walk a fine line between the legal and illegal. The legal definition of a pyramid (ponzi) scam is one where more than 50% of the income for an individual or the organization is funded not by product or service but rather by new entrants. If you are a rep who is selling more people than product then you are in violation of the law.
While Primerica is not a scam in the legal sense, they tend to use unethical practices when trying to recruit and sell product. I am talking about the “manager” positions advertised on craigslist, monster, and others. Also, “group” interviews are not an interview, trust me, it is just a way for Primerica recruiters to be more efficient when collecting the $200 entrance fee. Moreover, the recruiting video is highly unethical since it is shows only the very tip-top of earners who are now “successful”. Very few ever make enough money to cover their bills let alone have the means to buy boats, planes, mansions, etc. Oh, and if you’re in Primerica and you think that this doesn’t apply to you, then explain this company-wide mantra: “Fake it till you make it!”.
FACT: The $MART loans, mutual funds, and other financial products are typically overpriced and are a wrong choice for the vast majority of consumers. They are wrong for most consumers because they are specialty products but most consumers do not have specialty needs, nor can they afford them. Typically specialty financial products carry heavy penalties and fees making the loans more expensive and complicated than a traditional product.
Take, for instance, the $MART loan. Primerica reps will tell you that the $MART loan will reduce your total interest paid & monthly payments. That is fine, but the $MART loan on average costs two full points more than a typical loan. Therefore, if you were qualified for a 7.25% rate with a traditional lender, then your $MART loan APR would be between 8.75% and 10.75%! Now, they will tell you that you will pay off your loan in less time because of the payment structure, which is why your total interest will be reduced. However, any “smart” consumer should know that they can make double or triple payments and substantially reduce their interest, they don’t need a new loan or Primerica to be a SMART consumer. The irony is stunning. As an added insult, the $MART loan has an above average pre-payment penalty for three to five years, typically upwards of $5,000! Why? If you still think Primerica is ethical, then read on.
FACT: Primerica reps are not trained as financial consultants, financial planners, or financial advisers. The best they can do is to give you advice about this product or that, however their advice is not binding. CFPs, on the other hand are responsible for their advice and can be held liable for poor advice, you do not get that security with Primerica. All you get with a rep is somebody who passed a test (not hard) and completed a few hours of training (not hard). Most reps are not versed in the complexities or depth of custom financial products, which is why they work for Primerica; they make it easy for the rep.
In fact, many Full-Time Primerica reps are in dire financial straits themselves. Ask yourself, “would you take diet advice from a fat guy?” Probably not, so why would listen to a financial failure with “great” financial advice? This is where Primerica is the most unethical and has the most potential to do the most harm to consumers. Reps can literally destroy a consumer’s financial future with just a few pieces of bad advice.
Sure, Primerica is not a scam organization, and sure they purport to offer “smart financial programs” but Primerica does not train reps to protect consumers and offer them correct financial products, rather reps take advantage of consumer ignorance preying on the least informed and stretch the truth in order to make a few hundred bucks for themselves which may result in financial ruin for the client. Yes, Primerica is legal but are they ethical? I don’t believe so.
I am a financial advisor who has been in the industry for over 10 years. I have a degree in finance, and have the CFP and ChFC desigantions (for those of you who don’t know what that it, they’re designations one recieves after being in the business for a certain period of time, completes several college courses and sits for a two day exam). During my career, I have seen firsthand the problems that unqualified Primerica”agents” have caused. The company recruits unknowing people under the guise of an immediate six-figure income. They then have them set appointments with all of their friends and family so they can meet along with their “mentor” (more accurately a “closer”) who comes in to sell them Primerica insurance and mortgage products, and to recruit the potential client as well. Then, after all of the persons family and friends dry up and the “agent” has no one to talk to, they get no support from the company and eventually have to resign so they can go elsewhere. Meanwhile, the clients then have no agent, they have a highly expensive term life insurance product, a few mutual funds that may or may not be worth the paper they’re printed on, and worse of all, they have no real help from that point forward.
Also, the Primerica agents are encouraged to actively find sound permanent life insurance polices, replace them with term policies (which less than 1% pay a death benefit because it becomes too expensive to own at the time when the client actually dies) and take the cash, which ususally is lower than the actual value due to surrender charges, and push the money into mutual funds which they are unqualified to offer. The client then realizes 15-20 years down the road that he has paid his entire life and will have no death benefit when he atually dies. Don’t get me wrong, I believe that having term insurance is im portant to have as a supplement to permanent, but NEVER replace a whole life or universal life policy for term.
Anyway, I notice that there are several Primerica agents who have posted on this Blog and feel that Primerica is getting a bad wrap. I assure you, they are not. This is a company with predatory and unethical business practices. For those of you who do in fact work for Primerica and believe in what you are doing is in the best interest of the clients, I submit that you should really consider moving over to any of the reputable companies. It will be better for both you and your clients.
One final thing. I’m sure that some of you may take offense to this, and for that I am sorry. Another major concern that I have is that Primerica does not require a college education to be one of their financial representatives. While I realize that a college degree doesn’t make a person more intelligent, I honestly believe that a financial planner should be on the same level as your CPA or Attorney. There is a reason that the CFP (certified Financial Planner) board requires a college degree to get the designation. Again, I am sorry to those who this offended, but it needed to be said.
The truth is that Primerica is a company that targets middle to lower income families because they know that they are generally uneducated in the area of personal finance and they can take advantage of them.
Sorry for any and all typo’s, I typed this in a hurry.
Just wanted to add one thing. While citigroup is the Parent company of Primerica, they do not “back” Primerica as its agents represent, yet another ot their unethical misrepresentations. I pulled this from the “Important Disclosures” tab from the Primerica Website:
“Subsidiary of Citigroup
Primerica and its affiliates are subsidiaries of Citigroup Inc. Each subsidiary of Citigroup, and not Citigroup itself, is responsible for its obligations to its customers. Insurance and securities offered through Primerica Companies are not deposits. There is no bank guarantee. They are not FDIC insured. Securities may lose value.”
Don’t believe everything you hear. The truly qualified Financial consultants that are affiliated with CitiGroup work with the legitimate Financial Services company, Smith Barney. When your Primerica Agent comes asking you to buy mutual funds, ask them why they aren’t working over at Barney. You’ll hear some studdering…
I have read most of the posts, both good and bad. As a rep, I can testify we got about the best thing going as far as an opportunity to make money. I know it’s not for everyone, but I wanted to leave you some good bits of my knowledge and experience with the company.
The person that thinks interest rate and payment mattered more has an ARM (adjustable rate mortgage) that jumped from 7.37% to 13.95% Our S.M.A.R.T loan may have an interest rate higher than the client expects, but [the rate] can be reduced after 2 years of good consistent payments and we don’t sell off our mortgages to other banks. Plus, I’ll show you how to shave off years and interest on your loan as well as earn money on your escrow account.
But Primerica is a scam.
Typical cash value life policies implode after approximately 9 years, and those that think they have cash value end up finding out there isn’t any, and they have to pay MORE in to get that cash value back. Or if you want to borrow YOUR own money, you pay interest on YOUR money up front and it could take them 6 months to cut you a check of your money. And you make 1-3% on your supposed savings. Premiums are higher, and contrary to what jkristovich wrote, you don’t need insurance for your whole life.
According to Money Magazine dated Jan ’05, “You’re usually better off buying term insurance and doing your own investing.”
But Primerica is the scam.
We offer more solid term insurance for less money, AND the company paid out $6 Million in death claims 2 days after 9/11 to families that had our policies while other families are still waiting for their death benefit 5 years later.
But Primerica is a scam.
Real estate brokers recruit agents, and they get half the agents commissions for training them, called “brokerage override.” The only way an agent can make the same money as the broker is to become the broker and recruit and train agents of their own.
We do the same thing only better by encouraging competition rather than discouraging it,
But Primerica is a scam.
“My company is solid and knows what they’re doing with my money. I can retire on my 401K with them.” said a former Enron employee.
But, Primerica is the scam.
Let’s see. There’s the CEO, the 12 members of the board of directors, the 200 managers underneath them, the 5,000 supervisors underneath them, and the 10,000 employees under them that can be let go without a moments notice to appease the stockholders. Sounds almost like a pyramid,
But Primerica is the pyramid scam to watch out for.
I was told “people will pay top dollar (from $1495 up to $12,995)for financial advice” by a guy in a different network marketing (MLM)wealth management company, but as a licensed Primerica rep, I’ll help you for free.
But Primerica is a scam.
Most banks pay you 1% or less interest on your savings account, but charge you 18% or more for your credit card.
And yet, Primerica is still believed to be the biggest scam in the financial world.
Someone help me understand how!?!
Here’s some more for you to chew on:
Robert Kiyosaki co-authored a book with Donald Trump called, ‘Why We Want You To Be Rich.’ In it, he states, “If I had to make my millions all over again, I’d do it with a network marketing company.”
But, Primerica is a scam.
That mortgage I spoke of in my last post was from an article published by Forbes called ‘The Mortgage Nanny.’ That mortgage was written by JPMorgan Chase and Co. The woman wasn’t told she was getting an ARM starting at 7.37% and could go as high as 13.95%. The bank feels they did nothing wrong by not disclosing that to her.
But, Primerica is a scam.
True client story from our office – 75 year old man had 2 by-pass surgeries making him uninsurable. He thought he had $15,000 in cash value on his current cash value life policy. He was going to use that money to pay his final expenses. He got a letter 2 weeks later from his company saying his cash value had been depleted, and to get it back, he had to pay them $30,000. We have that letter in our office.
But, Primerica is the scam.
Cash value policies will pay the death benefit, but there’s hardly ever any mention of what happens to the money they put in savings on your behalf to build up the cash value.
But, Primerica is the scam.
I agree with an earlier poster, that most banks will CHARGE you to do a bi-weekly; a fee to set it up, another fee to collect EACH payment, but then turn around and apply it to your account as a regular monthly payment and not a bi-weekly one, thus not really saving you any time or money in interest.
However, I disagree with another previous poster that “a person can make double or even triple payments and get out of debt much quicker than they can with their S.M.A.R.T. loan.” OK, I’ll give you that, but name a few families that can afford to do that, genius.
But, Primerica is the scam to watch out for.
State Farm has stated they will no longer issue new home owners policies in Mississippi because it’s costing them too much money to pay the claims. Funny, I thought they were in the insurance business, and that’s what insurance companies were supposed to do – protect YOU from a major financial loss, not the other way around.
Oh that’s right, Primerica is the scam.
Companies and sports teams grow through recruiting. We also grow through recruiting.
But, Primerica is a scam.
Merryl Lynch laid off a thousand of their small funds portfolio managers to focus on the more affluent market. Money magazine says “Many financial professionals won’t take on customers with portfolios of less than $50,000.”
Investmentnews.com says, “Some brokerage firms have quietly stopped serving clients with portfolios of less than $100,000, while others have set the limit at $200,000, or even $250,000.”
The Wall Street Journal states, “More and more agents prefer to focus on the affluent market than the middle market. The need in the middle income markets, however, greatly exceeds the industry’s capacity to adequately serve these markets.”
Primerica wants to help middle income families, those that need it the most with either helping them invest their money or rollover money from 401Ks into IRAs, or give the average person a chance to make some real money no matter their previous educational or financial background is.
But hey, Primerica is the scam here, right?
“Opportunities aren’t always perfect, but you never know when they’ll come around again.”
I have to respond to this, since c_denger specifically pointed my name out.
“Typical cash value life policies implode after approximately 9 years, and those that think they have cash value end up finding out there isn’t any, and they have to pay MORE in to get that cash value back. Or if you want to borrow YOUR own money, you pay interest on YOUR money up front and it could take them 6 months to cut you a check of your money. And you make 1-3% on your supposed savings. Premiums are higher, and contrary to what jkristovich wrote, you don’t need insurance for your whole life.”
First of all, A “typical” cash value policy is a whole life policy, which never “implodes” because there a GUARANTEED cash values associated with the policy, and with certain companies, they pay a non-guaranteed dividend in addition. Now let’s examine the loan. Interest is charged because it wouldn’t be considered a loan if it weren’t, and you would have to pay income tax on any gains. The interest is extremely low, and is offset by the interest that is being applied to the capital, so technically you pay no interest. Also, it would take NO company anything more than two weeks (at the very worst) to issue you a check for a policy loan.
The policies that, if not properly funded, could “implode” are Universal and Variable universal Life policies. Sometimes the fault lies with the agent for not properly tracking the progress of the policy, sometimes the fault lies with the client for doing the same. If the client pays the absolute minimum premium every year, then yes, there is a good chance that the policy will lapse. The unfortunate thing is that these policies are designed for Cash Accumulation, so they’re not designed to work by paying the minimum premiums.
Also, The middle to lower income clients (primerica’s target market), are in fact going to be the ones who do need life insurance forever. All to often, (85%) of the time, retirees are living on fixed incomes and paycheck to paycheck, so they do in fact need to have that life insurance in force when they die.
On the opposite side of the spectrum, the upper-middle and upper class will need the insurance in force to offset possible estate taxes so that their families can benefit from their estate, not the government.
So YES, Primerica is a SCAM. Any company that actively pursues sound cash value policies, by that I mean that haven’t or aren’t going to “implode”, only to get commissions for new relatively (in age) more expensive policies, is a company that is perpetuating a SCAM.
Now a few more things…
First, Don’t even get me started on your SMART loans. Yes, ARM and Interest only loans (which do have their place in rare instances) are generally inappropriate and irresponsible. I generally advise my clients against them. I’m not in the Mortgage business, never intend to be, but taking out a higher interest loan to pay down the principal on your home is often stupid. Middle income clients, more than anyone, need to keep a mortgage because it will always be their #1 tax deduction, not to mention that their fixed mortgage payment will have 1/3 the purchasing power 25 years from now than it has today. As your income increases due to experience and inflation adjustments, the families highest fixed cost decreases.
That is the problem with all of the Primerica “agents.” The company trains you on concepts with flawed reasoning, and you guys suck it up without though or consideration. This is why I brought up the question of the education of the financial advisor. College, more than anything, teaches one deductive thought. Financial planning requires someone to truly understand financial concepts, not just to memorize talking points that are drilled into your head. This is one of the primary reasons there is so much turnover in your company. The agents are out peddling term policies for a living, but when they come up against a real financial advisor, they can’t even begin to compete. The truth is, Primerica’s people are out marketing themselves as financial advisors (which in many states is illegal if they are not properly certified), but they have no idea about how to build and maintain a proper portfolio, no idea about estate planning, and no idea about wealth distribution at retirement and beyond.
So tell me, what exactly are you doing for the client?
Also, look at the Primerica sales force. Over 80% of the agents are only doing this part time. Do you really want to put your financial future in the hands of someone who is only doing this “on the side?” That is something to really consider.
I’m sorry, c_denger, but get your degree, get your CFP, and then come on here and tell us how “good of a company” Primerica is.
I’m out of time right now, but I’ll address some more of c_denger’s “facts” in my next post.
I have to respond to this, since c_denger specifically pointed my name out.
You can call me Cliff. And my last name is D-E-G-N-E-R, although what I’ve written could make me a “denger” in your eyes.
First of all, A “typical” cash value policy is a whole life policy, which never “implodes” because there a GUARANTEED cash values associated with the policy, and with certain companies, they pay a non-guaranteed dividend in addition.
Cliff: If it’s guaranteed, then why didn’t that old man get his? Show me in writing the client gets their cash value on top of their death benefit other than in universal life option B; which by the way, folks, your agent may not tell you about.
Now let’s examine the loan.
Cliff: Most policies I’ve come across read “We will send you a check at OUR discretion and it could take up to 6 months.” And why should I have to pay interest or ask permission to borrow my money? Most policies are built around annual renewable term, and as the company’s expenses grow, well there’s only one place to make up that difference – care to guess where? As I’ve said, there’s no value in cash value. Suze Orman agrees – “The cheap cost of term life insurance is further evidence that permanent life insurance, also called cash value insurance is in most cases a supreme waste of money.”
Ever hear of the philosophy, “Buy term and invest the difference?” What about the rule of 72 and how a client can make more money investing for themselves as I’ve written in my previous posts?
Also, The middle to lower income clients (primerica’s target market), are in fact going to be the ones who do need life insurance forever. All to often, (85%) of the time, retirees are living on fixed incomes and paycheck to paycheck, so they do in fact need to have that life insurance in force when they die.
Cliff: In only one way, I’ll agree with you – if retired or an elderly person already has life insurance in place, then it makes no sense for me to replace it because it is too expensive and the damage has already been done. Which is why the younger generations need to get educated and become what we in the industry call “self – insured” meaning them having assets totaling $100K or more.
On the opposite side of the spectrum, the upper-middle and upper class will need the insurance in force to offset possible estate taxes so that their families can benefit from their estate, not the government.
Cliff: Death benefits are non-taxable income, hence no estate taxes. So, if my clients have enough coverage in place to pay off their debt and mortgage, take care of the kids education, as well as giving the family some income for a time, then Uncle Sam can’t touch it.
So YES, Primerica is a SCAM. Any company that actively pursues sound cash value policies, by that I mean that haven’t or aren’t going to “implode”, only to get commissions for new relatively (in age) more expensive policies, is a company that is perpetuating a SCAM.
Cliff: In my last post, I quoted news articles saying term is a better bargain, so how can it be more expensive? Are you saying getting more coverage for less money is bad? Wonder who you’re working for.
And don’t even get me started on the newest scam out there called “Return of Premium term.”
Now a few more things…
First, Don’t even get me started on your SMART loans. Yes, ARM and Interest only loans (which do have their place in rare instances) are generally inappropriate and irresponsible. I generally advise my clients against them. I’m not in the Mortgage business, never intend to be, but taking out a higher interest loan to pay down the principal on your home is often stupid.
Cliff: No. Putting my clients in another 30 year mortgage is stupid. We don’t do that. We try as hard as we can to get the TOTAL amount of debt paid off during the remainder of the original loan term, whether it’s 27 or 15 years. If I can’t do that, it’s an automatic refusal, and yes, I have done it. Is the rate higher? You’d be surprised that it’s pretty comparable at times, and if it is, it can always be reduced later on. But, I can still save them money in interest and years off their debt.
Middle income clients, more than anyone, need to keep a mortgage because it will always be their #1 tax deduction, not to mention that their fixed mortgage payment will have 1/3 the purchasing power 25 years from now than it has today. As your income increases due to experience and inflation adjustments, the families highest fixed cost decreases.
Cliff: Granted, they will have 1/3 the purchasing power 25 years from now, but I can help them get out of total debt and have a nice nest egg built up in 15 – 20. As far as the interest deduction goes – how long do you think that will be around, when Social Security itself will implode in 2015?
That is the problem with all of the Primerica “agents.” The company trains you on concepts with flawed reasoning, and you guys suck it up without though or consideration. This is why I brought up the question of the education of the financial advisor. College, more than anything, teaches one deductive thought.
Cliff: There are a lot of unsuccessful people out there with college degrees. I have a high school diploma, and everything that’s been written so far, I have researched, and found we are the best. Hopefully, I’m proving it today.
Financial planning requires someone to truly understand financial concepts, not just to memorize talking points that are drilled into your head. This is one of the primary reasons there is so much turnover in your company. The agents are out peddling term policies for a living, but when they come up against a real financial advisor, they can’t even begin to compete.
Cliff: I’m going up against you, aren’t I?
The truth is, Primerica’s people are out marketing themselves as financial advisors (which in many states is illegal if they are not properly certified), but they have no idea about how to build and maintain a proper portfolio, no idea about estate planning, and no idea about wealth distribution at retirement and beyond.
So tell me, what exactly are you doing for the client?
Cliff: I’m not a financial advisor, planner or consultant, but what I am is a financial analyst, and a damn good one. Telling me I have no idea on estate planning or wealth distribution at retirement is the same as me telling you that you have no idea considering everything we both have written so far. I have my licenses, but more importantly, I have morals and ethics same as you, and I have a stronger desire to do what’s best for my clients.
Also, look at the Primerica sales force. Over 80% of the agents are only doing this part time. Do you really want to put your financial future in the hands of someone who is only doing this “on the side?” That is something to really consider.
Cliff: What’s wrong with someone making a little extra money part time? Should a person choose to go flip burgers for $6.00 an hour all week long or go out and help a family one night a week and make an extra $500 or more? Better yet, do it as a part time BUSINESS which is what we advocate and take advantage of all the little tax deductions out there. Believe it or not folks, Uncle Sam WANTS you to keep your money and make a life for yourself. The tax code was written to be PRO-business and ANTI-employee. I learned that from a free tape of a former tax attorney. How much did you pay for your degree?
I’m sorry, c_denger, but get your degree, get your CFP, and then come on here and tell us how “good of a company” Primerica is.
Cliff: What the hell do I need to shell out $40,000 for a degree and waste 4 years of my life learning how to flip quarters into a shot glass or get certification for, after everything I’ve shared I’ve learned for $199?
But hey, Primerica is a scam.
Hey Folks,
Going back and forth with this person isn’t really doing any good. You should do your own research and find what fits you best. “Job security” is a misnomer these days. More and more people are learning that for themselves. Over half of all businesses in this country are now home based. Even the younger generations are feeling the same sentiment. I am not mistaken when I say the tax code favors the business owner.
Primerica is a great opportunity that unfortunately has been soured by well-meaning but overzealous people both within and outside of the company. I do recruit people, but I don’t do it in such a way that scares people away from it. All I ask them in return is a chance to prove me and others like me are trying to do it right despite what others have posted about us on the internet. Something like this is not for everybody. You’ve read my adversary’s postings, but this person hasn’t backed up anything with supporting articles about why whole life is better. I have. Even the book ‘Personal Finance for Dummies’ says term insurance is a better buy. I am mistaken though about estate taxes, and I readily admit that after I did some research on the subject, and now I can be a better rep for my clients.
Bottom line is, Primerica wants to help save you money on your debt, make sure you have the right amount of income protection in place in the event of the loss of a loved one and get you on the road to financial independence either through our service or taking advantage of the opportunity. There will always be taxes and there will always be ways to get around them, but don’t you think it’s better to retire in comfort without social security instead of living paycheck to paycheck or rely on the government or your children to take care of you in your golden years?
It is not “get rich quick” and those Primerica people that tell you it is should be run out of the company. In fact, my SNSD took 18 years to make his first million, but he still made it. I think the trouble with most people is that you actually have to go out and earn your money instead of just showing up to a job and collecting a paycheck. I think because of that, opportunities like Primerica get slammed as a scam.
The same people that say we’re not qualified to handle mutual funds are the same people that say we’re not real life agents. I assure you, I’ve taken and passed the same state insurance exam that even people with PhD’s have failed (and as I’ve said, I have a high school diploma, no degree which proves once you get a piece of lambskin parchment on your wall you actually get dumber), and am about to take the same Series 6 and 63 and 26 exams through the NASD that they do.
Ask your agent about the WACO script devised to use against us.
W – “What’s up? Or What’s going on? Haven’t heard from you in a while.”
A – Agent “Primerica reps aren’t real insurance agents. They only do this part time.”
C – Company – “Primerica is nothing more than a scam, wanting to take advantage of you and rip you off.”
O – as in “OH! I didn’t know you wanted term.” If you knew, then why didn’t you offer it to me in the first place? Because commissions on term aren’t as high as they are on whole life.
Sound familiar so far? It should, it’s the same old rhetoric used by the “financial planner.”
Folks, you don’t need a college degree to be successful. Just heart, desire, and a willingness to go after the opportunity that you feel is right for you. Could be with us. Could be with Mary Kay or you could be an underwater basket weaver. Or you could be satisfied working for someone else the rest of your life.
Just remember one thing: Common people go nowhere.
Some questions for our financial planner friend.
Why is there no accumulation of cash value for the first 2-7 years of the policy?
Why is there no mention of getting the cash value along with the death benefit?
Why should you allow an insurance company to invest your money and give you a meager 3% or less return on your savings, when you can buy term insurance for far less money for your family and invest the difference yourself in a good quality mutual fund and get a return of 8% or better?
Again folks, I’ll remind you that if a client I sit down with already has a better plan than what we offer, I won’t change it. But, I’m supposed to be the part time scam artist, so what does it matter what I do, right?
Do you educate your clients on the tax benefits of the Roth IRA? What about variable annuities?
Do you know how simple interest works and how it can help the client reduce their principal balance faster than a scheduled?
Here’s a financial concept I learned from a free seminar about how to pay off your mortgage in 12 years. Get an amortization table of your mortgage where it breaks down the payment into principal and interest. Make your regular payment as usual, then look at the next payment in the table. If you can afford to, send in that amount TO THE PENNY, and label it as “advanced principal payment.” The bank applies that to your principal balance and you just saved yourself the interest you would have paid in. Do that every month, and you’ll be free of your 30 year mortgage in 12 years.
Make DOUBLE the principal payment after your regular monthly one, and you’ll have your mortgage paid off in 7 years.
Did they teach you that in college?
Face it, your industry is dying and people are getting smarter than you’d like. Get your own facts straight before parading and waving your degree and your credentials around while attempting to slam the greatest opportunity out there
Obviously, I’ve touched a nerve with our friend Cliff, since he’s taken a substantial amount of time to post three times since last night, so I will return the favor. I’d like to make one thing clear. I do not in any way believe that permanent insurance is a better product in term. I recommend 20 times more in term than I do in permanent, but to say that permanent insurance has no place in the market is REDICULOUS.
Cliff: If it’s guaranteed, then why didn’t that old man get his? Show me in writing the client gets their cash value on top of their death benefit other than in universal life option B; which by the way, folks, your agent may not tell you about.
No way this was a whole life policy. Like I stated in my previous post, this had to be a Universal Life policy, since Whole life contracts ARE guaranteed.
Cliff: Ever hear of the philosophy, “Buy term and invest the difference?” What about the rule of 72 and how a client can make more money investing for themselves as I’ve written in my previous posts?
Again, I recommend much more term than permanent. But take a look at this link. Ms. BTID herself, Suzie Orman, Is going to get her ass kicked in estate taxes because she can’t leave her life partner her estate(she’s going to loose about $15.5 million dollars, in today’s money). If she’d have bought a substantial permanent policy, she could offset the estate taxes with the tax free life insurance policy.
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20070224/ap_en_tv/people_orman
Cliff: Death benefits are non-taxable income, hence no estate taxes. So, if my clients have enough coverage in place to pay off their debt and mortgage, take care of the kids education, as well as giving the family some income for a time, then Uncle Sam can’t touch it.
The only death benefits that are tax free are from life insurance. And As I stated in my last post, More than 99% of all term life policies will NOT pay a death benefit, and I can site several sources for that. Your term policies will not be in force for that 99% plus of your clientele, therefore, making them worthless as a way to nullify the estate tax. This is why the affluent investors would laugh at a term company in any estate planning situation, and they do laugh.
Cliff: And don’t even get me started on the newest scam out there called “Return of Premium term.”
Don’t offer it, never will. ROP term is just a modified Universal life policy, but you don’t have the flexibility you would have in the UL. Looks like you should study up on your product knowledge.
Cliff: Granted, they will have 1/3 the purchasing power 25 years from now, but I can help them get out of total debt and have a nice nest egg built up in 15 – 20. As far as the interest deduction goes – how long do you think that will be around, when Social Security itself will implode in 2015?
The Interest deduction will always be around, and Social security isn’t going to “implode” in 2015(you really like that word, don’t you? You might want to invest in a thesaurus). Your home will always be your biggest tax deduction, and in the middle income families, in most cases it knocks them down a tax bracket. How about having them “invest the difference” that they would have spent to prepay their mortgage. With a 6% mortgage and a portfolio that is returning 9%, the client is making more money than they are putting out (and that doesn’t even include the deduction), and their home is appreciating. But again, you would rather charge a higher rate on a proprietary, predatory loan product.
Cliff: There are a lot of unsuccessful people out there with college degrees. I have a high school diploma, and everything that’s been written so far, I have researched, and found we are the best. Hopefully, I’m proving it today.
I agree that a person doesn’t have to have a degree to be successful. But would you allow someone without a JD to represent you in a criminal or civil trial? Would you take tax advice from someone without a CPA, or Medical advice from someone without an MD? No matter how much research you’ve done, I’ve done exponentially more, and you are not better in any way. If you’re going to be a term company, why do you have the most expensive term on the market? Why not stick to your philosophy, re-price your term products to be equal to the good term companies out there (Banner, US Financial, First Colony) , and let your clients invest the difference? Because Primerica wouldn’t make as much money, that’s why.
Cliff: I’m going up against you, aren’t I?
Short answer, NO. You’ve made my argument for me as to the lack of a basic understanding of certain financial concepts.
Cliff: I’m not a financial advisor, planner or consultant, but what I am is a financial analyst, and a damn good one. Telling me I have no idea on estate planning or wealth distribution at retirement is the same as me telling you that you have no idea considering everything we both have written so far. I have my licenses, but more importantly, I have morals and ethics same as you, and I have a stronger desire to do what’s best for my clients.
Financial Analyst? Are you kidding me? In what world are you a financial analyst? Lets look at the education requirements of a financial analyst as defined by Encyclopedia Britannica:
Education
It is often required for analysts to earn an MBA or a professional qualification such as Chartered Financial Analyst designation (CFA) in the United States of America, or Certified International Investment Analyst designation (CIIA) in Europe and Asia, to advance beyond a certain level within a firm. Alternatively, analysts may earn a Master of Science in Finance MSF.
You need to think about what you’re saying to you’re clients, because if you go into their homes feeding them that load of crap you’re going to get yourself sued, and your E&O, if you even have it, won’t even think about covering you on that one.
Cliff: What’s wrong with someone making a little extra money part time? Should a person choose to go flip burgers for $6.00 an hour all week long or go out and help a family one night a week and make an extra $500 or more? Better yet, do it as a part time BUSINESS which is what we advocate and take advantage of all the little tax deductions out there. Believe it or not folks, Uncle Sam WANTS you to keep your money and make a life for yourself. The tax code was written to be PRO-business and ANTI-employee. I learned that from a free tape of a former tax attorney. How much did you pay for your degree?
Again, are you kidding me? Everything is wrong with having someone who’s trying to “make a little extra money part time” giving a client financial advice! If you’re going do own your own business, then do it all the way. Get the education, put in your time, and OWN your own business. Would you want to take advice from someone washing dishes at the local Applebees? It’s the same argument as before with the Attorney, the CPA and the MD.
Cliff: What the hell do I need to shell out $40,000 for a degree and waste 4 years of my life learning how to flip quarters into a shot glass or get certification for, after everything I’ve shared I’ve learned for $199?
Same response as above. Actually, my education cost over $150,000, and it was worth EVERY SINGLE PENNY. As much as you’d like to think you have, you haven’t learned nearly as much as I have, but that’s not to say that you can’t. I understand that you feel attacked, and it seems like you’re a pretty smart guy, but you should really look at being somewhere else. Go independent, (like I am) and do what is actually right for your clients, not what someone tells you is right.
Cliff: Why is there no accumulation of cash value for the first 2-7 years of the policy?
Why is there no mention of getting the cash value along with the death benefit?
First, I don’t know what company you’re dealing with, but any UL or VUL has immediate cash value, and Whole life starts after year three, strictly because the fees are front end loaded. I don’t like it either, but that’s just the way it is.
Second, You do get your cash value back as a part of the tax free death benefit. Have you ever wondered how a permanent policy can keep a level premium, which is ultimately best for the client? The answer is that as the policy builds cash value, there is less death benefit at risk for the insurance company, therefore the actual cost of insurance decreases, resulting in a level premium. The client’s family gets back 100% of every penny they put in, and then a whole lot more. With term, 1 out of every 995 policies isn’t going to be in force when the client actually dies. That doesn’t mean that I think that people shouldn’t have term, as I wouldn’t want to be that one guy and not have a TON of life insurance in force. This is why I almost always recommend a blend of both term and permanent (most of it in term, a smaller amount in permanent). And I don’t know where you get the idea that I make more money but recommending to my clients that they take permanent, but I’m paid the same either way.
Cliff: Do you educate your clients on the tax benefits of the Roth IRA? What about variable annuities?
Do you know how simple interest works and how it can help the client reduce their principal balance faster than a scheduled?
Yes, Yes, and Yes. Of course I do. I recommend more Variable (and sometimes Fixed) annuities than I do permanent insurance, although most of my clients cannot contribute to a Roth IRA.
And please don’t try to teach me about interest. The argument I’ve been making, which you obviously can’t grasp, is that paying off your mortgage is a concept that I fathers and grandfathers believed, but we’re in a different world and economy now. Any person that makes any sort of money (or even if they don’t make a high income) needs the tax deduction and higher liquid income now (to invest) than they need to overpay their mortgage. I don’t want my clients to pay off their mortgages early, because I’m trying to help them reduce their tax exposure as much as humanly possible, therefore helping them keep their own. Not to mention, that financial advisors shouldn’t be peddling high interest loans so they can make a quick buck, they should be giving their clients sound financial advice. But, oh, I forgot, Primerica agents aren’t really qualified to do that, are they?
Cliff: Face it, your industry is dying and people are getting smarter than you’d like. Get your own facts straight before parading and waving your degree and your credentials around while attempting to slam the greatest opportunity out there.
I’ve got my facts straight, and have the sources to back it up. Maybe my degree is worth a little more than you thought. And just so you know, my industry isn’t dying, yours is. I’m not an insurance agent, you are. I’m a fee based financial planner, and offer life insurance as the foundation of the financial plan. I have clients paying me five figure retainers on an annual basis to manage their money and estate issues, all the while you’re sweating to pay the bills and working as an agent part time to “make a little extra money on the side.” Don’t you dare to presume that your $199 fee you paid for your insurance licensing puts you in the same class as me, as I will out argue you any time.
You need to face the facts. You’re company is a PUNCH LINE in the industry, and always will be. Do you even know what the Smith Barney people regard you? They’re in your own company and they laugh at you. Do yourself and your clients a favor, invest the time and the money it takes to be successful in this business, and associate yourself with a legitimate company.
Wow, I Missed this…
Cliff: The same people that say we’re not qualified to handle mutual funds are the same people that say we’re not real life agents. I assure you, I’ve taken and passed the same state insurance exam that even people with PhD’s have failed (and as I’ve said, I have a high school diploma, no degree which proves once you get a piece of lambskin parchment on your wall you actually get dumber), and am about to take the same Series 6 and 63 and 26 exams through the NASD that they do.
You haven’t even taken your securities exams and you’re on this page telling everyone how qualified you are? Whatever little credibility you had just totally went out the window. First of all, any monkey can pass their Insurance exam, and once you pass the 6,63, and 26, pass your 7, 65 and your 24. Then and only then you are qualified to give investment advice.
And just so you know, it is illegal to give investment advice without your securities exams, so actually, yes, you are totally unqualified to handle mutual funds, variable annuities or any type of securities product.
You are right in that I am not qualified to give investment advice, since I am not licensed. Nor am I a “Financial analyst” as I once thought. That was a term I malisciously threw out, so yeah, I do need to be more careful.
I got passionate, because I do believe in the opportunity. I mean, others that have gone on before me have done real well. Yes, I understand there is a large turnover, and if a dishwasher at Appleby’s does Primerica on the side, then I would listen to them because they have gotten licensed.
It takes time to build a business, this I understand and am willing to put in as many hours as it takes. Have I been “brainwashed” by Primerica? No, because I have seen what we can do for people. Total debt under one loan where the payment is re-amortized after every bi-weekly payment, term insurance to protect the family through retirement, and whatever securities help I can give down the road once I’m licensed.
I believe in helping people more than making a sale.
For the record – that old man’s policy was whole life. Any “Dummie” can pick up the book “Personal Finance for Dummies” and read on page 328-331 (if I remember right) and they slam cash value. In ’95, WAY before I even heard of Primerica or A.L. Williams, I purchased a whole policy under the guise that it was more insurance and a retirement fund. When I saw I had no cash value the first 2 years, I felt scammed, so I cancelled my policy right away. If you weren’t as educated as you are now, and you saw that, would YOU feel like you were being ripped off? I’m sorry, but cash value just isn’t a good bargain for people.
Is the interest on the S.M.A.R.T. loan higher? Not always; it just depends on the client and where their credit score stands. Like I said, I have turned down loans on behalf of my client if the solution cost more money going out the door every month. My “job” as it were, is to help the client save money NOW. People are in debt NOW. People need to plan for reitement NOW. The letter you got in the mail from the last Commissioner of Social Security says “Social security was only meant to supplement income for retirees, and at the rate of benefits being paid out, the trust will implode (there’s that word again) by 2015, paying out more benefits than it is taking in, and will collapse by 2042.”
And about our term rates being more expensive, believe it or not, I encourage everyone I sit down with to shop around. I see myself more as a teacher that can give quotes rather than an “insurance agent.” Sometimes our rates are cheaper, and again, reread my post where I said “If the person I sit down with has a better solution in place, then I won’t touch it.” Why should I have them shell out more money so I can make a quick buck? I’m out of business if I don’t have integrity and trust, right?
Robert Kiyosaki and Donald Trump both agree that the middle class need to get educated financially. I’m totally on board for that, no matter how basic my knowledge may be. If you are on board as well, I suggest volunteering to give classes in your local community, because, let’s face it, the middle class is shrinking while the rich are getting richer and the poor are getting poorer.
Again, I feel strongly that I am in the right opportunity. As I wrote in my previous post, “Opportunities aren’t always perfect, but you never know when they’ll come along again.” Is it network marketing? Yes. Can the average person make a good living from it? Absolutely, IF they’re willing to put in the effort. In fact, my RVP makes over $100K a year, and she’s been in for 7 years, so yeah, it takes time, but it can be done.
Clearly, we differ in some areas, but we do agree that everything is done in the best interest of the client, if you’ve read my posts as clearly as I’ve read yours, you’d know I won’t budge on that principle.
Take care and best of luck,
Cliff
Couple of more quick points I feel I should make:
You wrote: I’m a fee based financial planner, and offer life insurance as the foundation of the financial plan.
Cliff: OK, I’ll agree that life insurance should be the foundation of any plan, and that’s what I teach.
You wrote: I have clients paying me five figure retainers on an annual basis to manage their money and estate issues, all the while you’re sweating to pay the bills and working as an agent part time to “make a little extra money on the side.”
Cliff: OK, but what about the “little guy?” What average family can afford to pay five figure retainers these days for financial advice when average families panic over the cost of gasoline going over $3.00 a gallon? And no, I don’t sweat trying to pay the bills. I make great money during the grave yard shift at my job to support me as I build my business.
I do research. I do read, constantly, and I fervently search out knowledge to be a better rep for my team and my clients. I’ll do anything and everything I can to help make sure the average family has a shot to dream again, without having to charge 5 figures on an annual basis to do it. I happily do it for free, and these days the wealthy are wanting to share their knowledge, which I why I keep referring to the book ‘Why We Want You To Be Rich’ by Donald Trump and Robert Kiyosaki (of Rich Dad, Poor Dad fame). They strongly believe that it isn’t debt that’s the danger to our country, it’s ignorance; lack of financial education.
I understand you do what you have to do for your affluent clients, and the knowledge you’ve shared with us ends up making me better, for those that can’t afford to pay the types of fees you charge. I’m not saying I’m better than you, I’m just saying all this has both made me think about some things as well as be better able to help my less affluent clients make more intelligent financial choices.
Something to think about.
Chances are good I’ve done a pretty good job of making a fool of myself, so why stop now, right? Some of you may find this analogy amusing, but I hope it does sort of put things in perspective. In my posts, I have admitted I am not securities licensed,,,yet, but I have not in any way given any kind of investment advice, only generalities.
Here’s my analogy: I work for a volunteer fire department, and have been trained to be a Corpsmen in the Navy reserve. All I have are international Red Cross certifications for first aid only. Now, I’m driving along to my weekend drill when I see you lying on the side of the road, unconscious, bleeding and not breathing. I have the knowledge and training to save your life, but I only do the Navy and fire department stuff part time.
Which would you prefer?
A. Do you want me to pull over and save your life with the knowledge and training I have been given, even though I only do it part time? Or,
B. Do you want me to leave you there dying because I didn’t go to medical school nor am I board certified to practice medicine and you’d rather wait for a fully accredited full time doctor who went to college, then medical school, then spent 2 years as an intern working 100 hour shifts that turns around and sends you a bill for $10,000?
If it’s the latter, tell Jesus I said “Hi.”
Using the same analogy, a person came along before me and helped you. Let’s say you were bleeding and the previous person applied a tourniquet and then left to go get help or call an ambulance.
If the tourniquet that’s applied is botched to where you could lose your limb or your life, should I as a trained medic leave it alone or do I fix it?
Likewise, if it’s applied correctly, should I adjust it so I feel better about myself while I could possibly screw it up and make it worse, causing you to lose your limb or your life in the process?
Should I use my knowledge and skills as a part time medic with only Red Cross certification in First Aid to help save lives, or risk getting called a joke and a scheister by those in the medical profession for practicing medicine without a degree, accreditation or AMA certifications by full time board certified doctors that invested thousands of dollars and have more advanced academia than I have?
I hope I’ve made a valid point.
This one goes out to all my Primerica brothers and sisters out there reading my posts. This “ultimate objection counter” dawned on me on my way back from seeing my boys.
There have been issues in the past about our company being called a scam and a pyramid scheme. Well, I’m about to share with you one that upon recollection, I feel is just as dangerous. Are you ready?
I will swear on a stack of Bibles and a Koran that this is all true. In 1989, I was still a stupid Senior in High School and met with someone that asked me to look over some tiles and pick some things that were important to me. After I listened to what he had to say, I knew in my heart that I was going for the right opportunity and I signed up to join it. He told me I would get a first class education equivalent to college as well as training and experience on a full time basis (which was one of the smarter things I’ve ever done).
Sound too good to be true so far?
This opportunity also offered a chance to earn a promotion. All I had to do was talk to my family and friends, and if one person joined, I would get a promotion. If 3 or more people signed up under me, I would get double promoted.
I suppose you’re asking, “Cliff. Was it Amway? A.L. Williams? Noni juice or whatever other network marketing/ MLM scheme there was at that time?” I wish I could say “Yes” to one of those, but it wasn’t. Hold on to your hats folks when I tell you it was:
The United States Marine Corps.
My [military] recruiter asked me to go out into my warm market of family and friends and talk to them about joining up. If I sold, (SOLD!!) any of them on an opportunity for good training and experience, travel and free money for college and one person signed up, I would earn a promotion to PFC (Private First Class) right after boot camp. If I got 3 people or more signed up, I would get promoted to Lance Corporal, that’s TWO promotions after boot camp.
You all read that right, but if not then it bears repeating: I was ASKED BY MY MARINE CORPS RECRUITER to talk to my family and friends and if they signed up, I could get promoted. Any of this sound somewhat familiar? Recruit someone and get them to join and I would get a promotion?
So, if you’re approached with an offer to join the military by someone that just signed up, you should run for the hills immediately because it’s a pyramid.
A question posed by my Financial planner friend was “Would you trust someone with your finances that does it on a part time basis to earn extra money on the side?”
Well, OK you shouldn’t. (GASP!) “Cliff, What are you saying?” Hold on and lemme explain. I’m saying you shouldn’t. Just like you should never trust your day to day freedom that you take for granted to good men and women to defend it every other weekend and 2 weeks out of the year in the military reserves. Part time “Weekend Warriors” that get the same training I got as an active duty full-time Marine, whom by the way not only do it for the training and experience but also earn a little extra money on the side.
Yes folks, by the same standard I, as a former active duty/ full time Marine *should* feel the reserves are not “real military” and consider them the “PUNCH LINE” of the armed forces. I wrote *should* but don’t. I wonder if the Pentagon shuns them like Smith Barney/ Legg Mason supposedly does us.
With what I just shared above, the USMC should not only be blacklisted on http://www.ripoffreport.com, but I should start a website of my own called http://www.USMCbusters.com where myself and others can post nasty things about recruiters out there that practice subtle deceptions themselves; like promised sign-on bonus money and/ or promotions that brand new fresh out of boot camp Marines thought they earned but didn’t get, guaranteed duty stations close to home but wound up half-way around the world in Okinawa, Japan, promised specialty MOS’s (jobs) and found out they’re a “grunt” infantryman or a cook to name just a few of the ones I’ve heard about, ALL in an effort to make their monthly quota.
Yes, folks, The Few and The Proud Marines should be listed among the dirtiest of players in the network marketing game that practice deceptive recruiting techniques at times.
But Primerica is a scam.
Now, in my Marine Corps career of (almost) 9 years, I’ve met average Marines, good Marines, Great, awesome, stellar Marines and Marines that were just total sh*tbirds. In Primerica as in every company and opportunity out there, you’ll have the same and I’ll testify to that because I see at least one of them on a daily basis in my bathroom mirror.
I earned all my [military] promotions and if I remember right, I could earn 100 additional points towards my cutting score if I recruited someone. Again, The Marines were the first to tell me “go recruit someone, earn a promotion.” After a while, my career got rather stagnant as far as promotions go. I didn’t like the politicking that went on plus the only way I could get promoted to Staff Sergeant was if I bided my time and hoped that someone up the ladder in my job field quit, died or retired. So, the Marines are a blend of both network marketing and corporate structure, in my opinion anyway.
Oh,,,speaking of coporate, here’s something else for you. The telecommunication company I work for during the graveyard shift had an awesome year thanks in part to our great efforts. So good in fact, they’ve rewarded us with a 2.38% pay raise! “Yippee!” right?
Inflation’s over 3%, folks. We helped them make more money and buy other telecomm companies, and they’re still paying us less to do it.
But Primerica is the scam.
For those wondering about “estate taxes,” well, I’m no tax expert, so I did some searching on line. Let’s see what our friends at http://www.irs.gov say about them:
“Most relatively simple estates (cash, publicly traded securities, small amounts of other, easily valued assets and no special deductions or elections or jointly held property) with a total value under $1,000,000 and a date of death in 2002 or 2003 and $1,500,000 and a date of death in 2004 or 2005 do not require the filing of an estate tax return. To find out more, refer to Estate and Gift Tax Introduction.
Currently, the exclusion is under $2 Million for filing years 2006, 7 and 8. Most people shouldn’t have to worry about them because of the difference between the gross estate and the taxable estate after deductions (funeral expenses taken from the estate, debt owed at time of death and the marital deduction – property that passes from one spouse to another). Middle income families should benefit from our total program, but DEFINITELY talk to your tax professional anyway, just to be safe.
This information was pulled from the web, (http://www.irs.gov/businesses/small/article/0,,id=98968,00.html) and ( http://www.irs.gov/businesses/small/article/0,,id=164871,00.html) and as we all know, everything written on the Internet is Gospel truth.
I wish to state for the record, that I AM a financial analyst, in the personal sense. You want to be a financial analyst for some corporation or for MSNBC, then by all means go get your degree. If you want to be a personal financial analyst, then pay your $199 and get your licenses.
Print this out. Share it with your up lines, down lines and sidelines. Tell them all that the military is just as dangerous as Primerica. Read it to those in your opportunity meetings that feel Primerica is a pyramid scheme or a scam or are otherwise hesitant on talking to their family and friends about an opportunity. Look me up on GoSolo and I’ll email this to you. Put this on every “Primerica slam” website that there is, and let’s all get to work and change the world.
See you at the top.
Cliff Degner
OK, Here we go again. I wasn’t going to post again, but our friend keeps making ridiculous statements. Let’s begin to address them:
Cliff: Have I been “brainwashed” by Primerica? No, because I have seen what we can do for people.
Yes, you are brainwashed, because I’ve seen what Primerica Agents can do TO clients, meaning damage and bad advice.
Cliff: For the record – that old man’s policy was whole life. Any “Dummie” can pick up the book “Personal Finance for Dummies” and read on page 328-331 (if I remember right) and they slam cash value.
Again, this policy wasn’t a whole life policy because as long as you pay the premiums, a whole life policy is GUARANTEED. YOU SHOULD REALLY LEARN THE BUSINESS AND THE PRODUCTS ASSOCIATED TO IT BEFORE YOU START GIVING ADVICE AGIANST THEM. And honestly, “Personal Finance for Dummies?” Is this the advice you’re giving clients? You must be kidding. I’m telling you, take all of your free seminars, free tapes and cheap books, and you get EXACTLY what you pay for, and it makes you no more qualified to give quality financial advice to your clients.
Cliff: OK, but what about the “little guy?” What average family can afford to pay five figure retainers these days for financial advice when average families panic over the cost of gasoline going over $3.00 a gallon? And no, I don’t sweat trying to pay the bills. I make great money during the grave yard shift at my job to support me as I build my business.
I don’t charge all of my clients fees, just in the cases where it is more appropriate to do so. I have some clients who are in the middle class, but I don’t turn them away, and I can argue that I do more good for them than my “A” clients, strictly because we have to do more with less.
Cliff: Chances are good I’ve done a pretty good job of making a fool of myself…
Yes, you have.
Cliff: Here’s my analogy: I work for a volunteer fire department, and have been trained to be a Corpsmen in the Navy reserve. All I have are international Red Cross certifications for first aid only. Now, I’m driving along to my weekend drill when I see you lying on the side of the road, unconscious, bleeding and not breathing. I have the knowledge and training to save your life, but I only do the Navy and fire department stuff part time. Should I use my knowledge and skills as a part time medic with only Red Cross certification in First Aid to help save lives, or risk getting called a joke and a scheister by those in the medical profession for practicing medicine without a degree, accreditation or AMA certifications by full time board certified doctors that invested thousands of dollars and have more advanced academia than I have?
You must be joking. The answer is, I do want you to do CPR on me in that situation, but would I want you do surgery, recommend therapy, or even prescribe me drugs? I think you know the answer. Again, you are not qualified to do so, and I would probably end up dead. There is a MAJOR distinction between applying first aid and practicing medicine, as there is between being a policy peddler and being a financial planner or “analyst” as you call yourself.
And as far as your whole “Primerica vs. USMC” argument, don’t even think that you have a valid point. First of all I take offense to it, as I am a Marine as well (2nd Battalion, Echo Company, 3rd Platoon from Parris Island, SOI at Camp Geiger, 0331 MOS, 3 ½ years in the 1/8 in Heavy Weapons Company) , and was a even a recruiter for a year. I only did four years, but I did pick up Staff Sergeant, and I wan there are several major differences between the Marine Corps and Primerica. First of all, when you join the Marines you know exactly what you are getting into, and they don’t over inflate your pay, success, promotions etc. Second, The Marine Corps pays tens of thousands of dollars, training, equipping, and preparing their marines to be professional marines, and reinforce that training every day (or every month and two weeks in the summer for reserves). They feed the marines, pay them, put the clothes on their backs, and give them the tools to succeed. Does Primerica provide any of that to its agents? I think not. Don’t you dare to compare the two.
Cliff: For those wondering about “estate taxes,” well, I’m no tax expert, so I did some searching on line. Let’s see what our friends at http://www.irs.gov say about them:
“Most relatively simple estates (cash, publicly traded securities, small amounts of other, easily valued assets and no special deductions or elections or jointly held property) with a total value under $1,000,000 and a date of death in 2002 or 2003 and $1,500,000 and a date of death in 2004 or 2005 do not require the filing of an estate tax return. To find out more, refer to Estate and Gift Tax Introduction.Currently, the exclusion is under $2 Million for filing years 2006, 7 and 8. Most people shouldn’t have to worry about them because of the difference between the gross estate and the taxable estate after deductions.
The exclusion is going to be back at $1,000,000 in 2011 (part of the sunset provision in the tax code), and probably isn’t going anywhere above that now that the Dems are back in power. Think about that. For your clients who are in their 30’s-40’s now, an estate of over $1,000,000 is not that big a deal, and a lot of the people I talk to can’t even retire on that amount of money. The equity of your home is included in that figure as well. If you’re going do be giving our financial advice, taxes are a HUGE part of that, so you’d better learn, and you’d better learn the right things.
Cliff: I wish to state for the record, that I AM a financial analyst, in the personal sense. You want to be a financial analyst for some corporation or for MSNBC, then by all means go get your degree.
You ARE NOT a financial analyst. How can you even think about considering yourself that? You have no education, no financial background, no securities licensing, no real training, and don’t plan on doing so, by your own admission, “If you want to be a personal financial analyst, then pay your $199 and get your licenses.” With each and every statement you write you loose a little more credibility. You may think you sound smart and that you’re making valid points, but the average person who reads this post is saying to themselves, “What is this guy talking about.”
You say that you’re acting in your clients best interest, but you just keep regurgitating that primerica bile that they cram down your throats every day. You are exactly the kind of person that the consumer should beware of. You have absolutely no qualifications, and yet you go out and misrepresent yourself as someone who does to your clients. If you really want to do what is in your clients best interest, and aren’t willing to go to school for the proper education, then you should be strictly an insurance agent, and partner yourself with a qualified financial planner in your area. That way, you can make a good living insuring clients and the financial planner could give them the proper advice. Most financial planners would even refer good business to you, and pay you for the business you send them.
But if you did that, you wouldn’t be able to make the quick bucks on your high interest “debt consolidation” loans, would you. If I were you, I would feel sick to my stomach every time you went into a home and lied to someone about how much you can help them and how qualified you are as a “personal financial analyst.”
You owe it to yourself to talk to one of the good companies, MetLife, NYLife, NW Mutual, Guardian, etc. They will take the time to re-teach you the business, pay you substantial “training allowances” to make sure that you’re spending as much time learning as you are insuring clients, and will provide qualified support (at no cost to you, no splits) to help you get business in and policies issued. You can build a high quality Life/Disability/Health business, and do it the right way with credibility.
If Primerica is such a great company, and you are doing so many good things, I challenge you talk to any of these other companies. If Primerica is so great, no harm, no foul, and you keep on doing what you’re doing. If you have half of the intelligence I think you have, you’ll see that there are much better options out there for your clients, yourself, and your family, and you still have time to undo some of the damage that you may have already done to your existing clients.
Are you up to the challenge?
Just one last thing. Every company recruits. They need to in order to stay competitive. The difference is that 99% of the companies recruit people who are suited to the position. Primerica will let anyone sign a contract. They use the old “throw s**t against the wall and see what sticks” business plan, and it does no one any good except primerica. The agent goes through selling his friends and family, runs out of prospects, doesn’t know how to get new prospects because the company hasn’t trained him, and he drops out of the business defeated. The clients then have a high interest loan, an expensive insurance policy, a few mutual funds that the agent picked out of “Money” magazine, and no agent. But primerica got their money, didn’t they? And it cost them nothing.
Sounds like a scam to me.
Personally, I think these debates are helping the folks reading than they are you and me. Probably an interesting read for them so far – two former jarheads battling it out over what they’re passionate about? I’m sure you’ll agree.
Kudos, by the way, for being a recruiter. Not an easy job, which also had about the highest level of stress above Drill Instructor. Good to know you weren’t one of the bad ones out there, but I’m sure you have heard of some shenanigans pulled. In boot camp (San Diego, 1st Battalion Bravo Co., then a 2881 Communication Encryption Technician, which should prove how dumb I am) my Senior D.I. asked some of my fellow recruits about some of the things promised, only to turn around and tell them, “Yeah, he f*cked you.” I heard even more once I hit the fleet, so, let’s not argue over that topic, my friend.
Once again – IT WAS A WHOLE LIFE POLICY!!!! The old guy got scammed by a WHOLE LIFE COMPANY!!! Maybe the ones you offer are guaranteed, but HIS WAS NOT!!!
The thing that gets me is that you keep thinking I’m out there peddling high priced policies or trying to rip people off when nothing can be further from the truth. I’m not the kid with a pyro disorder and a book of matches in a gasoline refinery. There’s a reason why David Bach refers to our company in his book, “Start Late, Finish Rich” on page 222, where he talks about direct selling. If it isn’t Primerica, then it’s Ameriprise or Merryl Lynch who’s put out a program of their own similar to ours called “Total Merryl.” “Total Ripoff” is more like it. I mean, c’mon, putting clients in an interest only debt consolidation loan to free up money to invest for retirement?
A note about Ameriprise folks – Be sure you read over your policy, and make sure it is a policy you signed for and not an illustration. We have come across that little subterfuge a time or two.
There’s also a reason why Robert Kiyosaki and Donald Trump promote network marketing in their book, “Why We Want You to Be Rich.” We have the best of both worlds, in my eyes.
There’s a reason why Prudential hit the panic button when the co-CEO’s of our company went to the Georgia and Alabama state legislature and said “You know, since we only do term insurance, how about we put together a test just for term?”
There’s also a reason why the Indiana State Insurance Commissioner, is a former Primerica rep as well, so obviously our company should know what it’s doing for that to happen, am I right? We hear more horror stories out there of what our competitors are doing from the audits he’s performed more than we hear of some of the shenanigans you think we pull.
As far as challenges go, I accept the challenge to get my securities licenses, so I, too, can use Morningstar, not ‘Money’ magazine or ‘Wizetrade’ or ‘ForEx made easy’ or whatever other “tools” you think we use. I accept the challenge to study more so I can teach people the same things you do. Personal finances are not the same as brain surgery, Dude. That was my point with the analogies I used.
My challenge to you is, stop thinking of me as a threat. Primerica is not as bad as you and other Financial Planners (whom Eric Tyson, MBA and author of ‘Personal Finance For Dummies’ also slams when he talks about cash value vs. Term) are making us out to be.
Some “mortgage broker” or bank is putting people in 40 and 50 year mortgages, interest only, negative amortization or adjustable rate loans and people are losing their homes. Is it the bank’s fault for not educating them, or theirs for not reading over everything? JPMorgan Chase Bank admitted they weren’t at fault with that woman’s mortgage, and the woman admitted she was too trusting, so who’s to blame? The bank’s for not disclosing to her the proper loan terms or hers for not being educated enough to know what she was getting into?
Other charlatans are out there inviting retirees and others to a free breakfast at a hotel, telling them about their great investment plan, only to get them to turn over their large sums of money and walk off into the sunset, leaving them penniless and destitute, and you call ME the scam artist? Don’t you DARE put me in that category.
And that isn’t Primerica bile rhetorical bullsh*t you think I’m spewing; this comes out of the insurance class I took, the Indianapolis Star, Yahoo! News, CNBC, MSNBC, Money, Investmentnews.com, Bankrate.com, American Bankers Magazine, Entrepreneur, Direct Selling Magazine, Success From Home magazine, the Internet as well as ‘Personal Finance for Dummies’ among the other economics and finance books I pick up from half-priced books or read at my local library for free like any other unqualified/ uneducated moron can do but doesn’t do for themselves; which is what you’re really pissed off about – I’m learning for free or at a fraction of the cost and sharing that knowledge for free, what you admittedly shelled out $150,000 and subsequently charge for.
Yeah, I’m the stupid one that’s scamming people.
If you think Primerica’s bad, wait till ‘Wealth Masters International’ picks up steam.
I know I have made some valid points because you haven’t shot them all down. We can go back and forth here, or you can email me at c_degner@yahoo.com and we’ll take it there. But at the end of the day, despite our differences, I’ll still have a beer or ten with ya. First rounds on me, the other 9 are on you since you think I’m struggling to pay my bills.
3-9-07 I think someone has definitely missed the point about education here. When you converse with a financial adviser of any sorts you expect the to be knowledgeable about their area of expertise. If I wanted advise from someone who had only read books in the library and was vastly unqualified, I could ask my grandmother. Repackaging advice that anyone could learn for themselves does not make you qualified in anything, in fact if the sources garnered are unreliable then you are guaranteed to spread bad advice. One approaches a financial adviser when the general notion that they do have real advice and experience; that their company has invested in them and that they are invested in what they sell. Primerica has absolutely no investment in their agents, as they are contractors and gain no standard benefits; the agents have at most invested 200$ and a few weeks of time towards their training (perhaps more if they are a ‘VP’). The real Financial Planner satisfies all of these requirements and from the start already has much invested in his company and field, regardless of time spent. While Primerica is not at face value a complete scam, you are more likely to be scammed, as there is so little investment by personnel. To compare: Primaerica Agent Investment: 200$ + 1 Month of time ; Other Agent: 150,000$ + 4yrs. If we factor in the opportunity cost of salary earned during the downtime at a minimum rate of $5.50, we have a total of 1080 for Primerica and a total of 194,000 minimum on the part of the other agent, not to mention the years of real experience on top of this initial figure. Do you honestly think the other agent will throw away $200,000+ and years of experience to cheat you? Not Likely. Your Probability of being cheated is much higher in someone with so little investment in the finance field. I’m tired of Primerica agents trying to silence all opposition and taint logic. Just in case you are wondering, I am not a financial planner, but anyone that really looks can see a problem.
I’ve been meaning to get back here and respond to some of the things c_degner put in his last post, but I’ve been busy. Here we go:
Cliff: As far as challenges go, I accept the challenge to get my securities licenses, so I, too, can use Morningstar, not ‘Money’ magazine or ‘Wizetrade’ or ‘ForEx made easy’ or whatever other “tools” you think we use. I accept the challenge to study more so I can teach people the same things you do. Personal finances are not the same as brain surgery, Dude. That was my point with the analogies I used.
Any idiot can print a sheet off of Morningstar, but you have to really know about this business to really use it efficiently. Do you know what the beta is? How about the r-squared? Picking investments is far more than chasing last year’s returns. It’s about being able to take all of the information that Morningstar complies and use it to help your clients to achieve their goals. Its about being able to prepare custom portfolio benchmarks to help your clients get an idea of how their investments are doing in relation to what THEY are trying to do.
Cliff: My challenge to you is, stop thinking of me as a threat. Primerica is not as bad as you and other Financial Planners (whom Eric Tyson, MBA and author of ‘Personal Finance For Dummies’ also slams when he talks about cash value vs. Term) are making us out to be.
The truth is, that I do not find you (or any other primerica agent, for that matter) a threat. I work in an entirely different market, and quite frankly, not a single one of my clients would ever do business with primerica. The people you guys are threatening are your clients. Again, unqualified agents out giving bogus advise are hurting the industry as a whole. Read this, this is a posting from Ripoff Report from last November:
“I previously was employed by Citigroup to be a customer service representative for Primerica shareholder services. During this time, I was able to discover several traits of this company that I did not agree with. This lead to my decision to discontinue working as an employee, for not only the primerica division of citigroup, but for Citigroup as a whole.
Citigroup trained us well to be excellent customer service representatives. Primerica even won third place in Dalbar for excellent customer service. Yes, Primerica may have excellent , citigroup trained, customer service representatives- But this in only to disguise the shady things that happpen within the company.
I recieved several complaints from clients who’s Primerica Agent would not only give them misleading information about their accounts, but would also dissapear from the scene at the time when the client would need them the most.
I would escalate this problem to the supervisors of citigroup, and to my surprise, even the supervisors have a negative attitude towards the primerica Agents.I felt that my voice was never heard, and citigroup pretty much held the attitude of, “Yes. the agents have many flaws and very little education of their products and services that they sell, but we just do our job.”
On several accounts, the PFS agents would give customers misleading information about primerica accounts that would result in the customers losing money because of penalty’s and IRS Audits. When the client’s would call to complain, all we could say is, “Sorry there is nothing we can do. You did sign a paper with all the policy’s written on it.”
Yes, I understand that they signed the contract and did not read all the fine prints, therefore, it is their own fault- But the sad thing is- The agents did not know what was on the contract themselves, and would not own up to the responsibilty of their mistakes. When the client’s call to complain to agents, they get the answering machine, and their agent is nowhere to be found.
The customer service department of Primerica is very much a seperate department than the department of the agents who sell the services. Too often did the customer service department know more about primerica’s products and services than the Primerica Agents who sell them. The sad thing is, we were only trained for 6 weeks!
I was always consumed with guilt each time I had to explain to my customers that there was nothing I could do about the severe mistakes their representatives did.
My theory is that primerica agents are too concerned in recruiting people that they do their client’s a complete injustice by selling them the products and then abandoning them. Client’s buy the services with the impression that their agent’s will serve as a manager of their retirement plans and their life-long financial advisor. This is completely false!
Citigroup is nothing but the pretty face to an ugly company. Citigroup trains customer service reps to make up for the dirty work of the agents.
Most reps have no problem as this is “JUST A JOB” But I could NOT contine to represent a comany as misleading and dishonest as PRIMERICA
Sophia
Cincinnati, Ohio
U.S.A.
How does that make you feel, Cliff? Still think you guys aren’t being misled? How about this quote:
Please tell me the first step to make my spouse realize that he has been brainwashed by Primerica. Our house is in bankrupcy, electric has been turned off, car reposessed, etc. because he hasn’t received a normal pay check in 3 years. I don’t know what to do. We have four children.
Vicki
Newark, Delaware
U.S.A
Wake up man! You didn’t respond to the real challenge I posed to you. Why not go to one of the reputable companies that you never hear complaints about? A company that is going to invest the time to help you be successful? What exactly are you afraid of? Do me a favor. Go online and type the words Primerica and Scam in google together. You will find a multitude of sites complaining about your company. Now substitute Primerica with New York Life, Mass Mutual, Guardian, MetLife, etc. Why do you think there are so many complaints? THINK ABOUT IT!
You sound like you’ve got a pretty good amount of intelligence, SO USE IT! Get out now and go talk with one of these other companies. Learn the business the right way, not by the Primerica credo, “fake it ‘till you make it.” If you go to any of these companies, you can find a senior agent who is looking to start to back out of the business and work with him. You’ll make money while learning the business from someone who’s done it for 30 years, not one of the 5000 “VPs” that Primerica has that have no real experience in the business. How can you not see this?
Here’s another reason not to work for Primerica or it’s parent company, Citigroup. They’re cutting 15,000 North American jobs to ship them overseas to India. Follow this link:
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/03/26/business/26cnd-citi.html?ei=5065&en=5d44504fb7cd084d&ex=1175572800&partner=MYWAY&pagewanted=print
Most of those jobs are going to be customer service. That’s the problem with working with a financial instituion that’s public, the Shareholders decide everything, all for a quick buck…problem with a public financial institution, the shareholders decide everything, aal for a quick buck.
I have been reading the pro and con post on this blog. I too received a voice message from some person indicating he had come across my resume and was interested in my background for a position he thought I would be an excellent candidate. I thought ok, great! I’m in the market for a job, so timing is good. After listening to the message a couple of times, something didn’t feel right. The message didn’t include the typical “stuff” you would hear from a Recruiter. Honestly, it did sound like pitch for a used car.
Like many of you, I googled the telephone number. You can guess… Yep! Primerica! Now, I have not done much research on Primerica. My only search led me to this blog. Because of my limited search, I’m not going to comment on whether Primerica is a scam or not. I do however have my suspicions.
Frankly, I don’t like ANY type of Pyramid schemes (Hey, it is what it is). I do have some simple questions for the Primerica advocates. If Primerica is such an ethical, straight line business concept, why leave such a generic message? why doesn’t the caller identify themselves as a Primerica agent? Why the deception in recruiting practices?
My guess is if the message were honest about the intent of the call, not so many calls would be returned. An honest message would sound like this:
“Hi, my name is Joe Blow and I am PROUD to be an agent of Primerica. I picked you because I notice you were looking for employment and this would probably be the best time for Me to exploit that unforunate situation. I have a scheme, that will earn ME and possibly YOU some extra cash. I understand you may not be available now. In that regard, I will continue to call and annoy you to the point where you will HAVE to have a conversation with me whether want to or not. At that point, I am going to make my best attempt to Convince you to become a part of this AWESOME opportunity by inviting you to presentation whereas, I can then annoy you further in person”.
Ok, so you may not get many returned calls. But it is honest and the potential recruits know what to expect.
This from ripoff report…were alot of you are saying bad mouths primamerica…..read the whole story….They apologize for making incorrect statements about primeamerica!!!
People think for yourself and get the whole picture before you decide to slam something…..
Rip-off Report Investigation on Primerica:
Primerica contacted Rip-off Report more than 6 months ago, wanting to address complaints on the site. The company has since made a commitment to work to resolve all legitimate complaints that come to its attention through the Rip-Off Report.
Every company receives complaints, and with currently more than 100,000 licensed representatives who serve more than 6 million clients in the U.S., Canada, Puerto Rico, Spain and the United Kingdom, the number of complaints on Rip-off Report are so miniscule, especially, considering Primerica has been listed on Ripoff Report on the top search engines.
After interviewing with executives from Primerica, it is clear that they are dedicated to helping their agents and clients achieve satisfaction, and will not allow a legitimate complaint to go unresolved. Primerica knows, just like any other company, they cannot be perfect, but that at the company level they will strive to make things right if there is a problem.
EXCELLENT PART-TIME AND FULL-TIME BUSINESS OPPORTUNITY PRIMERICA ISN’T A “JOB.” YOU’RE STARTING A BUSINESS.. HOW MANY OTHER BUSINESSES CAN YOU START FOR LESS THAN $200? PERFECT PART-TIME OR FULL-TIME, BUSINESS OPPORTUNITY.
Rip-off Report feels with all the consumers contacting us every day part time work, or full time work, that Primerica or being in the financial services business in general is a worthwhile business opportunity for many people. As a Primerica representative, you’re in your own business, on your own time. Primerica is a subsidiary of Citigroup, one of the largest companies in the world.
NO COMPANY IS PERFECT – COMMITTED TO RESOLVING COMPLAINTS QUICKLY DOING EVERYTHING POSSIBLE TO SATISFY CLIENTS
Rip-Off report knows that no company is perfect, and given the number of representatives and clients, Primerica is bound to be the subject of a certain number of complaints about improper agent conduct, as well as product and administrative complaints. Rip-off Report investigation found such complaints, but importantly also found that the company is committed to resolving such complaints quickly and doing everything possible to satisfy its clients. It also takes appropriate action against any of its representatives who are found to have conducted themselves improperly or unethically. We believe that the number of complaints against Primerica, whether through the Internet or other channels, is small when put into the context of its enormous size.
SOME COMMENTS ABOUT PRIMERICA SEEM OBSESSIVE TO THE POINT OF BEING RIDICULOUS
Another factor to consider is Rip-off Report has learned that, especially when a company is successful, some Internet and other complaints put forth as consumer complaints are, in fact, phony complaints planted by competitors to harm the reputation of the company. We have learned that a number of postings over time on Rip-off Report have indeed come from competitors of Primerica who wish to harm their reputation to gain a competitive advantage. Some have even become obsessive to the point of being ridiculous.. Any comments they make are made because of their own financial self interest and should be taken with a grain of salt when you read them.
EVEN THIS EDITOR HAS MADE COMMENTS IN THE PAST THAT HE REGRETS
About 3 to 5 years ago when I saw a number of Reports coming in, I took the negative statements at face value – – an assumption that was dead wrong, and one I regret as I now realize about how this company really is. NO, Primerica never threatened to sue. NO, Primerica did not ask me to post this. As a matter of fact, I, ED Magedson Founder of Rip-off Report, insisted that I address the uninformed comments I made in the past. The company has more than 100,000 agents around the world they are bound to get complaints, some of which will be inaccurate. No one, including me, is perfect. We will all make mistakes and we can never ever satisfy everyone. I have been very impressed with the Primerica people I have met and after the research I have now done Rip-off Report gives Primerica a very positive rating.
PRIMERICA COMMITMENT TO CONSUMER SATISFACTION / POSITIVE CHANGES MADE AT PRIMERICA
Primerica continually seeks to improve its client and agent service levels, including becoming a member of the Rip-Off Report Corporate Advocacy Program. The company has committed to respond to every legitimate complaint that it receives through Rip-off Report.
AFTER TALKING FOR MORE THAN 9 TO 12 MONTHS AND INVESTIGATING THE INNER WORKINGS OF PRIMERICA, RIP-OFF REPORT HAS LEARNED THE FOLLOWING- – – –
Primerica Financial Services, based in Duluth, Georgia, is a financial services marketing company with approximately 100,000 licensed independent representatives, many of whom work on a part-time basis. Through these agents, the company principally sells life insurance, investments and loan products. Rip-off Report has been researching the company over a period of several months. Our investigation has included talking with people who have joined the company as independent contractors, as well as engaging in direct discussions with some senior executives at the corporate level. After this rigorous review, the overall picture we see is that it is company that offers a business opportunity in the financial services field that is well worth considering for the right kind of person, although not for everyone. The company also has approximately 6 million total clients and has demonstrated to us a high level of commitment to treating its current and prospective clients fairly.
Of course, in any organization of this size there will be a few rotten apples, but Primerica has in place a variety of systems to address and work to resolve complaints fairly when they are brought to its attention. It is also worth noting that the company operates in the highly regulated financial services industry and thus in order to maintain its business, must stay in compliance with all applicable laws and regulations.
Founded in 1977, in addition to its 100,000 representatives, Primerica has more than 2000 employees and conducts business principally in the US and Canada; the company also operates in Spain as Citisoluciones and in the United Kingdom as CitiSolutions. Primerica and its affiliate companies are subsidiaries of Citigroup Inc. (NYSE:C). The company and its representatives focus on educating middle-income consumers about how to improve their personal financial situation.
Toward that end, Primerica markets a variety of financial products, as well as a business opportunity to join the company as an independent representative selling these principal products:
Life Insurance: Primerica Life Insurance Company and its affiliates, National Benefit Life in New York and Primerica Life Insurance Company of Canada, comprise one of the largest providers of individual term life insurance, with over $600 billion in face amount protection for its 2.4 million policyholders. In 2005 alone, the company sold $87 billion in affordable term protection to its clients.
Of course, the insurance industry, its companies and agents, can ALL be very competitive, whether it be Life, Auto, Home, etc, so you will always get competitors and some consumers to chime in about other companies — whatever company you go with, you need to go with a strong, well known company known for paying its claims to policyholders and that is one thing you will not find complaints about Primerica.
Since its inception, the company has paid approximately $10 billion in death claims to its policyholders, including more than $800 million in 2005. The rating agency A.M. Best, rates Primerica Life “A+” (Superior). This rating is assigned to companies that, in its opinion, have a superior ability to meet their ongoing obligations to policyholders. Additionally, Primerica Life is also highly rated by Standard & Poor’s with an “AA” (Very Strong) rating. The company is also a Charter member of the Insurance Marketing Standards Association (IMSA).
Investments: Primerica encourages its clients to save and invest for long-term goals, such as retirement and education. Primerica has over 28,000 representatives registered through the National Association of Securities Dealers (NASD), making it the largest securities licensed sales force in the US. In 2005, through PFS Investments, clients purchased more than $3.4 billion in mutual funds. In all, clients have more than $30 billion in mutual fund assets under management through Primerica. The company also offers variable annuities, and in 2005, clients invested some $1.2 billion in variable annuity products. The United States Securities and Exchange Commission (SEC), the NASD, along with state securities regulators, regulate Primerica’s securities business.
Lending Products: Primerica also helps clients consolidate high-interest debt or refinance through home equity loans. Primerica Financial Services Home Mortgages, Inc. (US) and Primerica Client Service, Inc. (Canada) are mortgage brokers specializing in the $.M.A.R.T. loan products marketed by Primerica representatives. In the US, these loans are underwritten and administered through Citicorp Trust Bank. Additionally, purchase money mortgages are offered through CitiMortgage and non-secured loans through CitiFinancial. In 2005, the company had a total net loan volume of $4.4 billion.
A BUSINESS OPPORTUNITY WORTH CONSIDERING
Not everyone is a sales person – not every one is made for every business and your success depends entirely on the effort you put into it, but, the investment involved is very minimal in light of the training and licensing that it pays for – all this talk about $199 being a rip-off. I guess people are wondering “why do I have to pay to start a job?” But Primerica isn’t a JOB, You’re starting a business; how many other businesses can you start for less than $200? Life insurance pre-licensing education is provided at no additional cost to you.
It is common for new agents joining Primerica to introduce their family and friends to the company’s products and business opportunity. This approach has allowed the company to spread information about insurance and financial services to a very diverse group of agents and clients, and has been at the core of the company’s success.
WHAT’S SO BAD ABOUT A WARM MARKET, SELLING AND BUILDING A BUSINESS WITH PEOPLE YOU KNOW?
.. Primerica is actually showing you how to go into your own business! – –
Some people, in any sales position, sell first to friends, family, neighbors and other personal aquaintances. But then what? First off, you should know that Primerica has some restrictions on cold-calling, but, In this EDitor’s opinion, anyone looking for a business opportunity is going to spend more than $199 a month driving around looking, if they are really trying hard to find a business position. = = Primerica offers a program and teaches you how to sell. That $199 includes the cost of training and getting licensed in one of the most rewarding industries in the USA today — with this training and knowledge and support of the company, you can take these skills and knowledge and use them anywhere you are licensed. Now, what college can you go to, to learn about and start in a business in such a short period of time for $199? Primerica is actually showing you how to go into your own business – and work when you want. But you should know, that your results are going to equal to your efforts. SELLING INSURANCE AND OTHER FINANCIAL PRODUCTS IS NOT FOR EVERYONE, but, it’s easier to sell than car and most other things but this business (like anything else) will not be for everyone.
The only problem that consumers might find (like with any company) ..if your recruiter / Primerica representative is not someone you are getting along with, you can contact the Company and they will try to resolve the situation.
The Primerica Business Opportunity: By joining Primerica as an independent contractor, “recruits” are generally trained to first study for and then pass their state life insurance exam, this usually includes completing mandatory Pre-licensing class work, as well as passing the test prior to making a life insurance product sale and earning a commission. Most people start with Primerica on a part-time basis to learn if they are the type of person who can successfully build a business selling financial products to friends, family members, neighbors and subsequent referrals. Agents also must pass the appropriate NASD and state securities training and exams prior to marketing investments. It should be noted that as an independent contractor, the compensation of a Primerica agent consists of commissions and bonuses earned upon the sale of a product, either directly or by an override commission generated by other agents recruited into his or her “hierarchy”. Readers should also know that Primerica representatives are not company employees but rather independent contractors, and thus receive no health benefits, office space or supplies directly from the company. Further, it is in no way a “get rich scheme”, although many representatives end up earning solid incomes, some even more successful agents earn very high incomes. It all depends on their ability and level of effort. Readers should be aware that while Rip-off Report found this to be a legitimate business offering a real opportunity, it is again, certainly not ideal for everyone.
While Rip-Off does not endorse any company, including Primerica, overall, our research demonstrated to us that Primerica is a solid, reliable company that while not perfect, stands behind its agents, products and service. If you are considering purchasing a financial product from Primerica, or becoming an agent, we would urge you to fairly consider the company as a legitimate option.
PRIMERICA’S COMMITMENT
We do know they have made a commitment to satisfy all legitimate complaints – past, present and in the future. If you discover Primerica or that a Primerica agent did not do what they say they would, please contact Rip-off Report only after you use this special email address PFShelp@primerica.com. Member businesses not following through with their stated commitments to complete resolution would be removed from the Corporate Advocacy Program.
Wow….let’s see this again!!
EVEN THIS EDITOR HAS MADE COMMENTS IN THE PAST THAT HE REGRETS
About 3 to 5 years ago when I saw a number of Reports coming in, I took the negative statements at face value – – an assumption that was dead wrong, and one I regret as I now realize about how this company really is. NO, Primerica never threatened to sue. NO, Primerica did not ask me to post this. As a matter of fact, I, ED Magedson Founder of Rip-off Report, insisted that I address the uninformed comments I made in the past. The company has more than 100,000 agents around the world they are bound to get complaints, some of which will be inaccurate. No one, including me, is perfect. We will all make mistakes and we can never ever satisfy everyone. I have been very impressed with the Primerica people I have met and after the research I have now done Rip-off Report gives Primerica a very positive rating.
Wow………Positive review from rippoff report….Oh wait i know what your going to say!!!
Rippoff report is a scam!!!Huh….
Primeamerica got to them huh…..
LOl….Lol…..Lol….
I have to comment on this. To put it in a nutshell, I do not know much about this company, but I will say this. Any company that has to spend this much time defending itself has problems.
As a result, I am not going to invest any of my time or money with that company. Anyone who starts looking for financial advice should get the referral from someone who is already stable. EVERYONE knows someone that is well off or at least comfortable. Ask who they use for financial advice, and go with it.
The problem is all of the people that have sound financial advice seem to preach the same thing. There is no quick fix; it takes time and responsibility to get yourself out of debt. Everyone I have talked to that got out of debt did not do it through a company that promises to give them a job while they make money at the same time. They also did not use a company that would let you “join” up anyway. Really could you imagine “hey, come on and sign up with us we will get you out of debt, then you can go out and sign other people up, and make money”. I don’t think that would go over well in the real world.
I would also like to point out that this company is obviously a “hard sell” company. If you have to “convince” someone to give you their money, you are screwing them. If you work for a sound financial company you can put together a proposal that will stand up to scrutiny from other financial firms. This company in question does not seem to be able to do that. I only say that because if you talk to several Primerica reps, they all have the same dialog. They also have an annoying tendency to go with the whole “ if I talk loud enough, and long enough then no one will ask questions” approach. To Top it off they don’t like a lot of in-depth questions. They do not want to talk about 30 years from now. They want to talk about right now. Funny, since most people are in the situation they are in BECAUSE of thinking about right now, instead of down the road! When you talk to people that understand the market they all bring up different talking points. The answer is easy; it is the difference between a knowledgeable rep, and someone trying to make a buck.
Take a step back and think about it. It is one thing to sell one type of investment over another. It is an entirely different thing to have to defend your company to get a sale. Any company that has to spend the time and effort defending itself that Primerica has, is not a company worth investing in. It does not matter what the name of the company happens to be. Of course that is just my opinion, I could be wrong.
Oh and just a free tip from someone who gets a lot of sales calls, when the potential customer says not now, the correct response is when? NOT to call repeatedly, or hound the person to the point they “break down and give in”. I also hope that they are not teaching until you make it fake it……you can get by on B.S. for about 10 min. with anyone halfway intelligent, after that you better know what you are talking about. It is the difference between cocktail party conversation, and making money! If you say Uhhh one time during your presentation, as you feverishly look for material… you are full of B.S. you know your product or you don’t.
David
For being a pastor of a new type of church you sound very angry and closed minded. You need to read the recant the editor of RIPOFFSITE.COM gave to PRIMERICA. He opened his mind. I am not saying everyone is perfect but the people I have worked with have been very honest and truthful in what they say and do. I have seen sitting with several trainers chances for them to get a mortgage or insurance signed by the customer and they seen it really wasn’t gong to help them so they didn’t recommend it. This is called being honest. Yes I work part time for them and I also researched all of thse sites and more and I also know you can’t believe everything on the WEB. Do some research on some who post to the varoius sites and find out their background. I think David you need to be careful about what and who you blog against because you can ruin lives and spread misinformation that can lead to a lot of hurt. Didn’t God say you should not bear false witness against thy neighbor? Yes this company has many VP’s vs a few but look how this company distributes that wealth vs regular companies. Look at what the CEOs of many big companies make. David look at the all of the positives and negatives before you go slam someones chioce of a living. PRIMERICA employ’s people from a wide background and many who have been laid off from big companies so they could move jobs overseas and pay less. Corp America wants us (the regular worker) to show loyality to them but where I ask is it in return? Basically David I ask you in the name of God that we both honor to be careful what you write. Spread love not hate and anger. Thank-You
Let me tell my story. I am a well educated person (who is not that great with numbers) who just wanted to believe that things could be better for myself and my husband. I was approached by a rep from Primerica…who told me and my husband they could show us how to get out of debt faster and save for our retirement. We signed on.
We got life insurance and took out a $20,000 loan and invested it into an RRSP (mutual funds). we were told that by doing so, we would get back $6,000 in taxes this year which would allow us to pay off our car loan and redirect the payment on to our RRSP loan.
However when tax time came along and we began to file it seems that having this RRSP made no difference to us. You see, my husband had been in University for 8 months full time and all or his income(grants and Scholarships) was non taxable. And I never made enough as a substitute teacher to have to pay in any money. In fact we had contributed very little in taxes and were guaranteed it all back in returns anyway.
That’s not the worst part… The worst is we had contributed too much to our RRSP and now have to pay taxes on it 1%/month if we leave it there to carry forward and 20% if we take some out.
So now we are not getting this $6000 back and we will still have our car loan, Plus the $20000 loan to pay on. Then on top of that we now have to pay taxes on the RRSP.
We hired an accountant and we are working to get Primerica to de-register our loan and RRSP. If they won’t do this, if they keep making my life hard, I vow to make things hard for them. It will be my life mission to inform everyone I can about this.
One more thought,
The Dodge Caravan is the best selling Mini van in North America, But it’s a Shit vehicle that brakes done more than any other and pollutes more than foreign low emission cars.
Primerica might make money and do well as a company but all it really is, is a Dodge.
These are bad people. Its not just one regional “VP,” its the whole system, and citigroup is not
looking so hot either.
I was a cashier at a department store I am still employed at. One day a lady gave me her husband’s business card and said I was what he was looking for. I was not because they wanted to hire an idiot. I researched them before I ever went to the interview, and most of what I read on the blogs were true. Here I am, a guy who’s job could be done by a monkey, and they wanted to hire me to tell people how to invest their money. In addition, they wanted me to fork up an application fee of $199.
After the interview I tried to do some real research, not just the blogs and post a comment stuff, I went through the local chamber of commerce and the Better Business Beaurou. These pep are slick. they operate just within the law. There is no way to bust them legally that I can see.
One other thought, I have noticed that alot of companies with bad reps have a modification of the word America in them. like Amerigroup, Primerica, Ameri Source. Just as a rule of thumb, if you come in contact with a company with ameri or merica in it, watch out for a scam, they may be trying to psychologically tap into your idea of patriotism and christianity in thinking that it is safe.
When was the last time that America was standing for anything that was “Christian”? Only in times of need to you hear people “pray” for the victims, or the loved ones, or what ever. Primerica is merely a company that encourages people to visualize your goals, and upon hard work, achieve them. Yes, oddly enough after having just gone to a convention in Cincinnati, OH. I saw that numerous amounts of the people that do make an above average means of living do seem to have and present a religious Christian point of view. Is there really something wrong with that? As for people who think that they were “duped”, what kind of car did you last purchase? As for Kile, what do you do for a living? Reading your blog post was an utter disgrace to any English teacher that ever had you as a student. Try spell check, it won’t make you sound so ignorant. As for Primerica being a “scam”? I hardly think so. It might have agressive “recruiting” techniques that every MLM company uses;except for WALMART. (Oh yeah, they got to were they are by promising that everything was “Made in the USA”. Walk through their stores now and tell me what actually is.)
Wow, Joshua, how can you tell anyone that they sound ignorant after that rediculous rant that you just posted? Read my posts earlier in this blog, and then tell me how great a company Primerica is. You’ve obviously been brainwashed by this company. You need to learn the business and the truth about the company you’re working for before you start spouting off about things.
I got a phone call from the guy who said who is working in marketing department this morning at 11. He found my resume on monster he was so impressed that he wanted to meet me tomorrow at 11 on Saturday. I got the address come to my computer found these comments i won’t be going to that “interview” tomorrow thanks to you… It’s a good thing that I googled them.
I just left a horrible job and put an email out to my friends and colleagues in the business letting them know I left and could no longer be reached at the former company. One friend/client called me and said that he had an opportunity for me to check out. I knew what it was the minute he gave me the pitch. Whenever someone answers your question with a question….well you just have to question the legitimacy of it. I have to drive 25 miles from my home to get to the office. Once I arrive there is no parking and the cars that are there well, let’s just say it wasn’t filled with Mercedes and BMW’s, Lexus or Infiniti’s. I walk into the building and am greeted by an obvious character who directs me to walk upstairs for the meeting, um I mean interview. There are now 20 people standing or sitting waiting for their “personal interview.” I am a recruiter by trade. I am in the business of hiring top talent in all kinds of industries. I know talent immediately upon seeing it and this was not it. This was barrel scraping at its finest and polished demeanor and suit was well out of place for these folks.
I was escorted to a small office where some guy asked me why I was there and pretended to conduct some sort of mini interview. I told him I knew exactly what this was and he couldn’t respond. I’m pretty sure he knew he was out of his league. I sat through the two hour presentation and didn’t take notes or write anything down. I wanted to leave so bad and I didn’t care what my friend thought, but I stayed. Then I thought, “What if this is true. What if I am a total jerk and people are actually making money doing this.” I put my $199 down that night and attended every class, every training and was open to being brainwashed like the rest of the lemmings.
Fast forward three months. Once you are in a Primerica location and you find a closer location to home, you can’t switch. Even though you work for one great company (Citigroup) you aren’t allowed to work from another office. So I’m stuck driving 50 miles round trip every time I have to attend a meeting. On top of that because you do kitchen table presentations you drive all over town on the evenings you aren’t forced to going to training. There are only two meetings you ever have to attend, ‘The ones you want to go to and the ones you don’t want to go to’. Each meeting I’m told is more important than the last. Each meeting the same information is given every single time. I’m not “Pumped up. Fired up. Super excited.”
All agents appear to be uneducated about what they are offering and the trainings are nothing more than motivation meetings where if you don’t buy into the message you are degraded. They promise a lifestyle where you will get to spend more time with your family and travel and afford a higher quality of life. When?? Here’s how the schedule breaks down: Monday night 7pm – 9pm training; Wednesday night 7pm -9pm training; Friday night 7pm -9pm recruiting calls, Saturday morning 8am – 12pm conference call training and interview/orientations. Every other night is to be spent across the kitchen table with a “recruit” and your upline. Weekends are also reserved for any kind of recruiting expo, home show or training where you have to travel out of state for a mass company wide training. So when does this family time kick in? Because remember, they don’t want to bring people in who don’t have jobs already where their ass is being kicked by a 50 or 60 hour workweek and they don’t see the kids or have the money in the first place to drive all over town. Of course if you respond, “I’m too busy” the appropriate Primerica response is, “I can appreciate that. Hey if you won the lottery and you had to pick up the winning tick on Saturday would you tell them you couldn’t make it?”
WTF!
Well, I just got my Primerica check in the mail today. In the past three months I made $3.63 I feel dirty just knowing how they conduct business.
It isn’t real. It isn’t a quality of life and it is sad they are scamming so many people out of valuable time with their families and money.
I was reading all of your comments about Primerica and was wondering if you ever came across some people that the company helped. To make a good creditable arguement you need to look at both the good and the bad in anything you are trying to agrue against. I would really like to know both sides of the issue. Because without both elements you’re just bashing.
Are you still reading this blog? Recruting? Look at Enterprise Rent-A-Car. Pyramid? Look at any corporation with a President. What to be happy and make new friends? Join a MLM, be positive, have fun , get off the couch, stop watching TV, and know that Primerica and Citi ROCK! My friend is 29 years old and makes over one million a year….. I think he is pretty happy. I just taught my other friend how to earn about 2 million by the time he retires? If that doesn’t sound fun, go back to your traffic, cubicle, TV, and negative life. As for me, I am going to go have a blast with the coolest people I have ever met.. AT PRIMERICA!
I was doing researh on Primerica. I found this page…I was a bit surprised! Its really sad how people like you and lot of the others just post information without seeing things first hand!
Primerica has helped me and many other families get out of DEBT, Protecting my family, and helping invest properly! You have to look at where you do your research!
You seem to have broke thinking because from the start you felt negative about it…it might not be that Primerica is bad just your negative thinking…
Do some research? Correctly!
I’m done with seeing how internet savy people can just create such crap like this!
I know not everyone in Primerica might do the right thing put don’t think just because one person did something wrong everyone will or the entire company will.
Do you ever go somewhere where you always get great service every single time(a restuarant, mechanic, movies..etc.) No right! You see sometimes people aren’t trained right or sometimes people just don’t care.
Use common sense!
I really wish you the best, you really need it!
I see how this works. Some people post some negative stuff, and anyone who posts a counterpoint is dismissed as a “corporate shill”
Makes for a pretty one-sided argument, doesn’t it? Imagine if other things in life worked that way, only one side of the story was ever accepted, and the other side was dismissed without ever actually being considered. Hey, you’re in court, but only half of the evidence is valid, and it’s just the half that would convict you. Any evidence that would prove you innocent? Nah, we don’t want that here, we just want the bad stuff. Enjoy the chair.
Primerica’s “free” Financial Needs Analysis is a joke. Guess how many times the result DOES NOT include buying Primerica products? ZERO.
Anyone wanting NEUTRAL financial advice should start reading up themselves or PAY a FEE-ONLY financial planner. Trust me, that will be cheaper in the long run than investing in garbage so your “friend” the rep and his uplines can make commission off of you forever.
Here is a good article:
http://www.canadianbusiness.com/my_money/investing/article.jsp?content=20060829_114915_4480
Citi is the largest Financial Company in the world and they just let this scam slip through their radar…BS. A lot of ignorant people post on here because they hear something or just because they know it is a network marketing company, and they believe that there is something wrong. Some people dont make money because they don’t take the proper steps to make it work.
A friend of mine called me up the other day asking if I might help him get in some training for his new job by listening to a presentation. He said it was for free financial services, I figured in the end of it he was probably selling something but when he mentioned a free financial analysis, I said why not? We’d been meaning to have one done but just never got around to it, not to mention we had no idea where to go or how to begin to have one done. With a mortgage, insurance policies covering everything from life to home, and a car payment..it definitely couldn’t hurt to have someone come in and tell us where we might save some money and what to do with it, right?
So my friend shows up with another rep in tow and proceeds to explain the “FNA” and at the end asks if this is something we might be interested in. My husband was a little reluctant but finally agreed. We needed one done for crying out loud, what did we have to lose if it’s free!
The next day, my friend and his recruiter sat down with us, filled out our budget, talked to us about our future needs, dreams etc and then went over our mortgage paperwork with us as well as our insurance. We learned from them that we not only had a sub-prime loan but were well on our way to losing our house. Somehow we were supposed to come up with an extra $1800 a month when our supposed “fixed” rate mortgage went up at the end of two years AND there was also a fun little balloon payment at the end of that dark tunnel of over a $100K. All of which our loan officer glossed over so smoothly to get us into a loan he knew was bad and would eventually end in a foreclosure. Yeah, we got SCREWED!
Talk about reality check..the people we had trusted to do right by us had completely and totally screwed us to line their pockets with OUR hard earned money! It’s no wonder we middle to low income families can’t get ahead when there are crooks out there screwing us every chance they get!! How do these people sleep at night???
We were victims of predatory lending and felt fools for having been duped, but even when we tried to educate ourselves before the fact, it was just too much to handle so we turned to “professionals” for help. Did we ask for it, was this our fault?
Maybe.
But we are no different than the thousands of people that are losing their homes as we speak!
What this company showed me was how to protect myself from this ever happening again, protecting the future of my family with knowledge, preparing us for the future. They didn’t try to sell me anything but we bought an insurance policy through them anyway after shopping around and finding that their rates were comparable. We went with them because they were honest, plain and simple, they genuinely wanted to help us when they saw what we were up against. They saved us a load of heartache and misery, not to mention $$$..and if they make money off of us, it’s because we chose it and not cheated out of it like so many other companies we’ve come into contact with over the years!
Hey David, get over it your freekin crybaby. So your scared to go into business for yourself. Don’t try to ruin it for others who arn’t. Go back to your wonderful 9 to 5, it will work out perfect after 30 yrs of working for someone else.
Josh– Just read This
http://www.ripoffreport.com/reports/0/229/ripoff0229393.htm
I got a visit from a woman from Primerica yesterday. At first I didn’t think much of it. She gave me a brochure and asked that we talk before going to the presentation. Well, I’m very busy right now so I decided to Google this company before investing my time. I also noticed in the brochure that I would have to put money up front to join even though I am going form my life license on my own…..yet I’d still have to pay to join. I got suspicious (I’ve been scammed many times and I have a rule that I never join a company asking for money up front). Thank you for this information to help me make the decision to walk away.
I don’t know many pyramids or “scams” that require a license to join and are government regulated.
I don’t know many companies that has a goal to pay it workforce as much as possible.
I don’t know many pyramids and scams that are backed up by a top company valued in over 2 trillion of assets.
I don’t know many pyramids and scams that receive positive feedbacks from many different credible sources.
I don’t know many pyramids and scams that receive positive feedback form Ripoffreport.com
http://www.ripoffreport.com/reports/0/229/ripoff0229393.htm
I’m actually glad that not everyone is openminded and is ready to embrace the opportunity, because otherwise it wouldn’t be the opportunity it is.
For those who think it is a pyramid and a scam and god knows what else….well keep working at your crappy job untill you’re 85 and hope you find some money to live the rest of your life decently.
For the rest, I’ll see ya at the many company trips
HEY ITS SIMPLE I WORK FOR COLUMBIA UNIVERSITY IN NY AND THE DIRECTOR OF ACCOUNTING IN MY DEPT WITH A PHD IN COLUMBIA UNIVERSITY HAS LIFE INSURANCE WITH PRIMERICA AND A HE’S INVESTING IN THEIR MUTUAL FUNDS FOR RETIREMENT IF YOU ARE SKEPTICAL ABOUT THEIR SERVICES YOU ARE AND IDIOT WITH SO MUCH CREDIBLITY BEHIND ARE U INSANE AND NOW ONLY FOR 99.00 DOLLARS U CAN GET STARTED WITH ALL LICENSES PAID IF YOU ARE A ENTREPRENEUR THERES NOTHING BETTER OUTHERE SO IF THERES SOMEONE TRYING TO SHOW YOU A SERVICE THATS GOING TO HELP U UNLESS U WANT THE SOCIAL INSECURITY CHECK ONLY YOU ARE WHAT I CALLED AND IGNORANT DO YOUR RESEARCH AND IF YOU WORK FOR ANOTHER COMPANY WITH THE ALIKE SERVICES U WILL NEVER MAKE AS MUCH AND WILL NEVER HAVE THE SAME FREEDOM LOOK I DONT WANT TO OFFEND ANYONE BUT IS THE WAY I AM AND I ALSO WOULD LIKE TO IF U HAVE SOMETHING TO SAY TAKE LEGAL ACTION NOT WRITE CRAP IN GOOGLE
Check out my blog http://obe231.blogspot.com about what I write about Primerica.
Wow. I’ll be really sarcastic and facetious here…there are a few people here that are speaking earnestly, and then there are a few that need their diaper changed and need to stop talking.
Your local grocery store was put there by a regional SALES team, to which the regional SALES MANAGER gets tons of commissions…anyone drink beer? Well next time you go into any store that sells beer, remember, that was put there by an ‘ACCOUNT SPECIALIST’, of which he received many ‘COMMISSIONS’ for getting their product in the stores. Then the distributor company hires others into a “SALES/MARKETING TEAM”, and as a result of the TEAM efforts of landing accounts, the ‘ACCOUNT SPECIALIST’ or “SALES MANAGER” gets even more commissions.
Your local grocery store?…full of products sold by scam artists. Your house?…sold by a realtor that gets ‘COMMISSIONS’..total scam. The car you drive?…scam on wheels- sold through distributors and sales representatives from overseas…scam scam scam.
MLM- Legitimate business ‘tool’ taught at your one and only Harvard Law School…yeah..total scam.
Pyramid scheme – an illegal distribution of money exchange providing NO products or services.
Pyramid scheme – is NOT MLM. Read a book people…
So, even though people are going to read this and respond as fools- even I have fun posting, even though its wasting my own time.
A memeber of our church had a vision to develop a ‘Primerica’ sales team for Pastors/Ministers. His father was a preach that died, and was left with no benefits for his family because the church did not provide a retirement plan. What a scam!? To provide a means for our pastors and ministers, who provide truth and spiritual health to dying communities…Now thats a whole new story about churches, but just like Primerica, one bad rep, or a member of a church, does not decide the will of God for anyone. We experience bad ‘seeds’ all over, and we blame the higher authority, whether it be Primerica or God.
My wife and I are signing the papers for the Primerica debt program…ultimately the retirement investment may be contingent on stocks, but what company in the world isn’t? – I feel better knowing some extra money re-allocated from what I would have been paying in evil interest rates will actually be vested in something positive and meaningful.
Besides the $200 licensing fee, another option is a one time $99 license fee and $25/mnth fee for the website access. If you want to go to college instead…go ahead. Its a very honorable decision- but don’t bad mouth a mere $200 or $99 fee, work with your thumb up your butt and expect to get paid, and then bad mouth the people that are making an honest effort. Go to college and pay $40,000 to get an instant entry level job (unless of course you’re going for doctor or lawyer, but I don’t feel like vesting 10yrs of my life in that sense)….
$40,000 vs. $200….. ? hmmmm?
I don’t know what else to say – I look at articles on the web too – But I’m not that foolish to put all my confidence in its sources, I’d rather speak with someone I know personally that is PERSONALLY involved.
As a last note, I won’t bad mouth anyone that works 9-5p and thinks EVERYTHING is a scam…so you don’t like change or challenges. There really isn’t anything wrong with people wanting to work. I wish I could get back to living on a farm. I hate the commercialized industry today – it IS ONE BIG SCAM in itself.
There’s nothing wrong with diversity! 🙂
Well, I must admit that when I first came across the Primerica opportunity, my mother sent me links of websites claiming the company was a scam. I spent 1/2 hour reading them, and man was I ever angry…I could feel my face going red.
The bottom line is, I called my upline and yelled at him through his voicemail for lying to me. Then I thought, oh man, that was dumb now wasn’t it. Let me check some legitimate websites to see if these scam blogs are true.
I typed in Google, “Is Primerica a legitimate company”, and I got the Financial Services Commission website. http://www.fsco.gov.on.ca/english/licensing/licensedinsurers.asp. On page 66, Primerica is listed as a lisensed insurer. OKAY, now I felt really dumb for having read unknown blogs and believing that crap, even if just for a moment.
I have worked with Primerica for 2 years now, am a Division Leader with the company, and get paid well for doing what I know is right for clients. Even the $MART loan is good for people folks. How do I know? Any of you deal with the banks on a regular basis? Get this, my husband just bought a car, only $5000, and the bank offered him a line of credit, 7% interest, $250/month payment for 2 years. This is a “revolving” debt vehicle people, they charge you interest every day on revolving accounts….DID YOU KNOW THAT? So anyway, I told the bank representative that I wouldn’t fall for a revolving debt, and to give me a fixed loan for $5000. Well miss, she says, the rate is going to be 15.5% on the loan, and only 7% on the line of credit. Okay I say, tell me then, what will the monthly payment be on the loan and for how long at 15.5%. It will be $250/month for two years on the loan, she says. Well, isnt’ that exactly the same as the line of credit??????? I thought you were trying to tell me the line of credit was cheaper? Don’t you charge interest on a line of credit everyday, and only each month on a fixed loan? Well yes, she says. To avoid being rude, I just said give me the loan, and fax me the two examples of payments for the line of credit and loan. PEOPLE, if you don’t believe this, call up your bank and have them do a quote for you. Say your unsure of whether a line of credit or fixed loan is best, get them to quote you payments/term/and the rates for both on $10,000 or something. SO GUESS WHAT EVERYONE, PRIMERICA IS THE REAL DEAL AND ITS’ THE BANKS THAT HAVE BEEN RIPPING YOU OFF FOR THE LAST , WHAT , 100 YEARS.
All I can say people is do your research. You should all know the difference between credible and non-credible sources. When you are checking out new opportunities like Primerica you need to read everything, hang on to information from credible sources, and throw the rest away. Ripoffreport.com does not count as a credible source. But since so many of you think it is I’m going to re-submit a link previous bloggers have posted to one of Ripoff Report’s stories about Primerica.
http://www.ripoffreport.com/reports/0/229/ripoff0229393.htm
Primerica is not for everyone, but everyone should at least take a look at the opportunity. In Primerica everyone has a chance to make as much or as little money as they want. The best part about this is that you get to help people with the things that truly keep them awake at night – money, debt, saving for retirement etc.
There is nothing seedy about the products Primerica helps people with. Term Insurance – If you can’t fog a mirror the death benefit is paid. I’m not going to get into a whole life vs term discussion but I will say this – Life insurance is meant to replace income which is a term need. It’s very simple but it does require planning. Most people are under insured, are you? Why? Investments – Primerica works with the best in the business like AGF, AIM, Legg Mason etc. These are companies you already know and trust.
I would just like to clear up this RVP misunderstanding that so many people still do not get. RVP stands for Regional Vise President which is to say an RVP is NOT the company Vise President. Most RVP’s that I know make at least 100K per year, have been around a long time, and have helped a lot of people get their financial situations in order. Does this sound like a bad thing? Anyone can do this with hard work and dedication. The pay structure scares a lot of people because it is unconventional but if you can look past that you can do great things.
David,
I would normally let these blogs go by without merrit, but you come off as so ignorant I couldn’t your lack of knowledge.
Unfiortunately, you don’t seem to realize the internet is not a regulated medium, so anybody can write anything without retribution…true or not. Moreover, to use blogs like you have as “matter of fact” is not only dangerous but downright naive.
In fact, why would you believe in God,as there are 2 million bloggers that hate him. Why would we shop at Walmart or drink Coke for that matter as there are hundreds of thousands of blogs on them. So you see, if your sources are not Moodys, Better Business Bureau, Standard & Poors, Morrningstar and manny others who reasearch companies to protect us consumers for real, then your just spewing whatever garbage you head from your friend (another broke follower with no real ideas.
I have placed more than 50 million dollars in place for insurance, most of which families which didn’t have ANY. Those that did…were getting downright screwed. I have helped dozens of families out from financial ruin and made myself roughly 50K in the process this year.
Your right on one thing…I have been brainwashed. A good washing is exactlt what I needed to bring me back up from what society and guys like you have done. By the way, I can say the same about your church but I dont, because I do not pass judgement before I get ALL the facts…unlike you.
Lastly, Primerica is a division of the LARGEST COMPANY IN THE WORLD. Did you actually think you came in and uncovered somthing with your incredible detective work? Much like a Gym, people sign up and then refuse to do the work it takes to win big, myself excluded.
I would be very careful what you write also, as there are MANY God fearing christians in Primerica and boy they tithe very well.
Ingnorance is not always bliss my friend.
Primerica is a corporation governed by officers and a board of directors. When you check Primerica out you are NOT checking out the people you may deal with.
Primerica is a product provider and owns the agency that the Independent Contractor Agents write business through.
Notice that you are always told to check out Primerica or Citigroup. What you are not able to do is check out the credit, experience, integrity, character, truthfulness or criminal record of the individual you are being asked to join or do business with.
And for most people they have no knowledge on how to do this or where to do this. So you just have to trust that you have been told the truth.
In 1989 this company had 225,000 agents according to the founder Art Williams. If the outfit is so great why do they only have 100,000(+-)some 17 years later, especially when you consider they recruit over 100,000 annually?
One more tidbit, according to LIMRA the number 1 writer of term insurance in the U.S. is AIG.
WOW…do you guys have a lot of time on your hands? Why doesn’t everyone mind their own business and just worry about themselves? If you don’t like the business, that’s awesome! Those that believe in the company’s values and concepts, that’s awesome! Can you guys move on?
yeah respect each other.. or maybe the people saying that primerica is a scam are those insurance agents who ripped off families before primerica came into picture and save the family.. so for guys searching for answers don’t rely too much on cry babies saying crap about primerica..try for urself.
primerica is not a scam if it does not work for u.. its bcoz u did not work hard & long enough.. or maybe its just not for u.. its not for everybody.. it must fit ur personality & work ethic..just be a client thats the best alternative.
$200 worth of licence??? very much worth it.. how many hundreds have u spent & waste before? here u will have the financial knowledge that will help u through out ur life regardless of u becoming big in primerica or not.. and the beauty of it u can share it to others specially ur family so they won’t get screwed by others.THANKS
I would love to tell my story so perhaps save someone from the hell I went through. I was a middle school teacher. I was hustled into Primerica by someone I trusted. I put 8 months into it, heart and soul and here is what happened to me:
I got my life and securities license, got myself and my fiance an outrageously expensive life policy by my trusted upline, embarassed myself by calling my family, quit my teaching job, went into 8K in debt because of no income, and drove all over Michigan for months. I also pushed products I have no knowledge of except that they would give me a check. I watched a 10 minute video which allowed me to sell mortgages. How scary is that?
Here is what I got in return:
I actually owe Primerica because my only clients cancelled their insurance and didn’t go through with the crappy mortgages either. I have paid the company over 1500 dollars in fees and expenses. I am so pissed off that this is legal in the US.
I am now going back to school to get my second BA. I am so very disappointed in myself for being sucked into this.
And for all of you Jehova Witness Primerica salesmen, every single thing I have seen posted (and I read the WHOLE blog), I was taught at the FAST track school too.
My office brainwashed me to say all the same things too. They called it “overcoming objections.”
Here are some examples:
-Normal jobs are for normal people.
-Break the glass ceiling.
-Be your own boss.
-It’s all a numbers game.
-People don’t plan to fail, they fail to plan.
BLAH BLAH BLAH- BITE ME A L WILLIAMS>
Oh, and my trusted upline, who said she makes 400 dollars and hour and has her own cook: She lives in a 2 bedroom apartment and she has a husband and 2 teenagers. The only cook I saw was her husband. He cooks for the fam now because she made him quit his “dreaded” corporate job that was making over 100K so they could be partners in Primerica. So he’s a little bitter, and the divorce papers are in the works.
The RVP of my team drives an Aspire and his wife works 2 jobs. My dad was right, hard work pays off and good people sometimes get scammed.
I guess I should be happy that 10 years from now, my husband won’t be doing the cooking and I will not be scraping the barrel, calling people all day, and scamming people for a living.
There is NOTHING a PFS rep could say to come back to me. I know all the lies, because I was trained to tell them myself. But remember, look on your business card, it says representive under your name, which means you are working to push someone else’s product. And if you don’t have a business card to look at, I’ll mail you my remaining 998.
jkristovich-
If I can make money doing the same thing you are doing without a degree. Why wouldn’t I? I would have to be retarded to pass it up. If I can pay a little money to take a class required by the state to take and pass the insurance test to do what you then have an oppurtunity to make money with a company “on the side” as they say, THEN AMEN!. I know the money can be made its already been proven to me. As far as what you are actually doing for people, Primerica “in my experience” has not in any way influenced me to get my family involved as customers or anything of that nature. In fact, I didnt even come on under someone low in the company. My upline starts at a SRVP. I asked him right away if thats what he did. Go to his family first, of course he didnt. If you want an easy client then of course your family is the answer. They trust you already and want to see you succeed. He went to strangers. As I. we dont do business with someone unless we can help them, what would be the point of setting a client up to fail? So that they cancel there policies and pull out? Obviously we want our clients to do well so that our company keeps them and we do well. If someone already has things under control, thats awesome! We are there for the millions that dont. I think its great that Primerica at the least is giving and eduaction of finances to anyone willing to learn. As far as Scam, a scam is illegal, nothing they do is illegal, who cares about ethics, that comes from within you as the agent anyway, forget the company. All companies have altearier motives and have some evil in them. Its up to you whether you are going to really help someone by telling them the truth, whether you can help them or not. The people you can help will love you forever. the people you trick into thinking your helping them when all your doing is trying to make a buck, will hate you. If i have to flip burgers at mc donalds to be able to feed my children, is that unethical? Even though I am encouraging and participating in adding to America’s overweight and health problem? Its not. Im not saying primerica will make you rich. There is deff. an oppurtunity though. your other option is to win the lottery. While you work your 8-5 salary job and save up nothing but debt. You will need someone like jk whatever. And you will need money to pay him for his work, or you can come to me and see if I can help you for free. I might not be able to. You never know.